this post was submitted on 18 Nov 2024
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[–] [email protected] 129 points 1 month ago (2 children)

I'm all for it. The Democrats have been a joke since they fucked Bernie. They're terrible and don't give a shit about their voters.

[–] [email protected] 49 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

To be clear to the naysayers: It's not that we're angry Bernie got fucked, it is what it is. We've just seen the writing on the wall SINCE he got screwed over.

Also we're a little angry.

[–] [email protected] 37 points 1 month ago (5 children)

Oh, they were a joke long before that. In 2006, when we went from having a congress that rubber stamped everything Bush wanted to a congress that said they were displeased with Bush as they rubber stamped everything he wanted.

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[–] [email protected] 51 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (5 children)

I think its time to deconstruct it tbh. Name's tainted and "neither" has been the most popular candidate for the past 3 election cycles now. People are itching for a new party to support that doesn't make them feel like their vote is worthless

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 month ago (1 children)

This would imply years of (effectively) being out of power. Even if by some miracle you would win the presidential election, you would have no local infrastructure to build on. It would give the GOP effective power in many states for an another decade.

On the other hand, look at how easy it was for Trump to completely hijack the GOP. That’s the model you should aim for.

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[–] [email protected] 50 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Or, now hear me out, Socialism.

[–] [email protected] 25 points 1 month ago (19 children)

Absolutely. Just don't use that word. The propaganda is so goddamn ingrained in the American psyche we might as well just call it something else and try to bypass that fight.

[–] [email protected] 19 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Hand companies over to their workers, call it supercapitalism, and Americans will eat that shit up

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 month ago

"Blue collar capitalism"

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

"true capitalism" or some shit

Disparage actual capitalism for not being capitalist enough, and do an Indiana Jones hot swap for the actual end goal of worker ownership.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 month ago

The freedom to eat, the freedom to earn a fair day's pay for a fair day's honest work, the freedom to afford a house, the freedom from wall street usury, the freedom patriotically build secure and supportive communities, freedom healthcare, protecting the landscape of the greatest country on earth for all of America's generations to come, etc.

Loads of ways to spin free market socialism, take your pick.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 month ago

It's just a branding problem that needs a more modern name for today's modern voter

Democracy+

Democracy McDemocracyFace

Buddy Democracy

Msilaicos

Ocialismsay

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[–] [email protected] 44 points 1 month ago (5 children)

We've had several elections in recent memory where it's been really clear that progressive Democrats win elections compared to centrists (mostly midterm elections but still). Somehow that lesson hasn't stuck, and I wouldn't be surprised if Harris' defeat also doesn't teach this lesson. At this point the old guard really just needs to die.

People want change, GOP is offering it and people are eating it up. They just have no idea how incredibly stupid that version of change is.

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[–] [email protected] 32 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Good. A party that is not beholden to its constituents has no business running for office.

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[–] [email protected] 29 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Reconstruct?

Raize it with impunity and forge something actually good

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 month ago (9 children)
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[–] [email protected] 28 points 1 month ago (9 children)

the party is hopelesslty corrupted and wont even acknowledge why they lost. Its time to dump the dems and build up a progressive party.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (10 children)

That would be after FPTP voting is replaced with RCV or STAR in all 50 states. Trying a third party before those steps will hand the federal government to the GOP for the remainder of my life.

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Absolutely this.

How many times are we gonna be Charlie Brown trying to kick the football before Lucy pulls the ball away?

This party isn't here for us. They do not represent our best interests. They simply care about the ruling class/ultra wealthy.

They have purposely not followed through on their campaign promises so many times. Time to dump them.

DNC isn't getting my vote anymore. Time for a new party.

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[–] [email protected] 23 points 1 month ago

No shit?!

The writing was on the wall when they ignored voters moving towards the Democratic Socialist. The money was more important.

Populism is relatively easy, even when that populist is a fascist.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

How do you construct a worker's party in a country where corporate bribery has been made legal and there is a class of billionaires ready and eager to squash any legitimate improvement to worker's living conditions with their nearly unlimited power/capital? They literally own the means of state and media propaganda, and the means of state violence to protect our beloved economy from the society that exists in subservient subsistence to it.

I vote blue out of harm reduction, but there's no escape in the US without necessary complete governmental and economic collapse. It is too well corrupted into protecting capital over people. I think in the desire for perpetual stability for the sake of commerce/profit, something vital was simply discarded in the modern nation state model:

The renewal that can only come from the collapse of the past.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Are these the same union leaders who backed Trump, because while they're right about the need for reconstruction, I'd like to exclude any fascists from the effort.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 month ago (6 children)

Just assume they are because they want Democrats to change in favor of workers.

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[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 month ago (4 children)

While I wish them luck, the DNC is structured in a manner that retains power for those with the best ability to secure donations, and these donations come overwhelmingly from wealthy Capitalists. Moving the DNC to a more progressive platform has been the project of Bernie and the Squad for decades, and it seems to have little impact on the broader party line. The DNC isn't really organized in a democratic manner, it operates more like a business.

Workers should instead focus on rapidly expanding their own organizations, which does make a meaningful impact on policy adopted. If you have something to bring to the bargaining table, the DNC is more likely to play ball, but you have to make them do it.

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 month ago (3 children)

I wonder if it's just a bit of an overreaction to draw conclusions about the Democratic Party when the difference between Kamala and donvict is < 2%, the Democrats ran a VP after Biden dropped out very late in the election cycle without any primary, incumbents the world over are getting voted out, the candidate was a woman in a nation full of misogyny, AND people have this perception about inflation (that is mostly wrong).

Anyone going to factor that in at all?

[–] ryathal 21 points 1 month ago

Democrats also put themselves in a position where the only choice was a vp candidate who was the least popular candidate 4 years ago and only became VP because Biden promised a woman of color.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 month ago

The fact that the difference between Kamala and convict was so small is enough grounds by itself imo

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 month ago

I wouldn't mind it honestly.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 month ago (4 children)

Dems didn't "lose" the working class. Misinformation overshadowed the message.

There's a lot the Dems can do for unions and working-class normal folks. But Kamala could have cured cancer with a touch and they wouldn't have believed it because everything else they consume downplays the improving economy, security and stability under Biden so it was ultimately useless.

Buckets of roubles on Facebook and X won this election.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

The Dems began bleeding the working class after Carter.

The problem is that - outside of Obama in 2008 (who campaigned as left of Clinton), and Sanders in 2016 and 2020 - there have been almost ZERO efforts to court the increasingly jaded and apathetic working class voters who have to work harder and harder every cycle only to be disappointed by the candidate they believed in not following through with decreasingly attractive policy proposals.

Again, she wasn’t TERRIBLE, and no matter how disconnected she was, she would have been > than 🍊… but her team had her trotting out LIZ CHENEY over allowing a Palestinian to speak on stage at the DNC.

This idea that there was NOTHING she could have done to win over the small percentage of apathetic voters to push her over the edge is simply not true.

The enthusiasm from the Democratic base disappeared shortly after the campaign backed off the sort of initial good decisions they started off with (like choosing Walz and letting him call Rs weird).

…And then the overpaid completely disconnected party consultants just kept pushing her to move all the way to the right as much as she possibly could under the delusion that THIS time (like Clinton tried) we could get the R cultists to come out and vote for her… I mean they had a literal billionaire Mark Cuban excited for their candidacy.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 month ago (4 children)

The DNC has completely abandoned the working class. It's not misinformation. They simply do not care about us.

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[–] Grandwolf319 7 points 1 month ago

How would that even work? They are doing exactly what their ~~owners~~ donors want.

Are they saying that rich people should want unions or that there needs to be other ways to fund politics?

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 month ago (2 children)

You can reconstruct the Democrat party all you want. It won't make stupid Americans smart. They'll still fall for whoever is best at peddling misinformation, fear, and hate.

The internet and media in general has been weaponized. So unless we're talking about the Democrat party learning how to go low and spread extreme misinformation and paranoia in order to win an election, then we're just wasting our time talking.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (6 children)

Fuck the Democrats.

After that piss poor performance and immediate "we're going to just do it again" what do they think people are going to bother getting out for?

Run Harris and the same shit again and get fewer votes than last time dipshits I don't care.

Edit also to clarify I mean the DNC/ party leaders not voters. But fuck me too lol

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[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 month ago

Start by investigating musks money for votes scheme

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Or reconstruct the whole damn government. Entire thing is fucked

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