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245

States push ‘fetal personhood’ bills despite outrage at Alabama IVF ruling (www.theguardian.com)

submitted 5 months ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

37 comments fedilink hide all child comments

Lawmakers in more than a dozen states have considered efforts to give legal rights and protections to embryos and fetuses

Lawmakers in more than a dozen states have considered efforts to endow embryos or fetuses with legal rights and protections since the start of the year, and at least three states have advanced such “fetal personhood” legislation since February, when an Alabama supreme court decision ruling that frozen embryos are “extrauterine children” unleashed national outrage.

The Alabama state legislature responded to the repercussions of that ruling – which led several of the state’s in vitro fertilization (IVF) providers to halt their work – by passing a bill to protect providers’ ability to offer that treatment. Yet, just hours after the legislature passed those protections, Republicans in the Iowa statehouse passed a fetal personhood bill that amends state law to criminalize causing the “death of an unborn person”.

…

As of 2022, at least 11 states – including Alabama – have what Pregnancy Justice identified as “extremely broad personhood language that could be read to affect all state laws, civil and criminal”, according to a brief by the organization. “Those are the ones that really have the power in their language itself to increase criminalization of pregnant people, to threaten IVF, to threaten forms of contraception and obviously to ban abortion,” Sussman said.

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[–] [email protected] 60 points 5 months ago (2 children)

Even if a fetus a person, it doesn't actually mean what they seem to think it means.

There's no law stating one person is required to donate blood, organs, or even time and effort, to save the life of another person.

So a fetus is a person now. That doesn't give it the right to take anything from its mother against her will.

[–] [email protected] 24 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Ib4 they reach the end game and pass a law for mandatory organ donation and start harvesting the organs of the poor for the rich.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 5 months ago (1 children)

I wouldn't even be against mandatory organ donation so long as it went to those who've been waiting on the donor list. So many more lives could be saved. At the very least make it opt out.

[–] prole 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Mandatory organ donation is an awful idea that 100% would be misused and exploited.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Maybe, the first few year but the good outweigh the bad very quickly

[–] prole 1 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

Huh? What do you think would happen after the first few years to change anything? We have millions of homeless people, and about half of the country don't view those people as human. Now combine that with an entire class of uber-wealthy sociopaths who are willing to do literally anything to save themselves from an illness and/or prolong their own life...

Throw mandatory organ donation into that pot, and baby you got a stew going... What do you think would happen in that scenario? It's actually basic supply and demand. A massive supply of organs belonging to a group who's seen as less than human, and a demand for new organs by the wealthy....

I feel like that's a recipe for something, but I just can't put my finger on what exactly.

Maybe you can help. What do you think is the next logical step in a situation like that? Do you think the wealthy folks suddenly change and decide to accept their mortality and donate their wealth to house those homeless people and everyone lives happily ever after? Wouldn't that be fun?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 5 months ago

If there was actual accountability and no way to cheat, it would be a giant positive for humanity but you go ahead and rant and rave.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 5 months ago (2 children)

The counter argument to 'bodily autonomy' is that not donating blood or organs is a passive act, while an abortion is an active one.

I don't agree, just putting it out there.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Wow, is this actually their argument? Wild.

"You weren't actively having your blood and organs harvested, so saying no to that is okay. But that fertilized egg you are carrying against your will? Well..."

[–] [email protected] 2 points 5 months ago

Back in 2000 AD, Right To Life President George W. Bush came up with a compromise that allowed some embryonic stem cells to be used in research, because some embryos are more equal than others...

[–] [email protected] 2 points 5 months ago

So is shooting someone raping you and it’s still legal because you get to control what someone else does to your body.

We cannot even harvest organs from a deceased anonymous person without their permission. A corpse has more body autonomy than a woman

[–] [email protected] 57 points 5 months ago

Christian fascists and their ongoing efforts to turn women into second-class citizens.

[–] Tar_alcaran 50 points 5 months ago (1 children)

I can't wait for someone to freeze 12 embryos and claim a few thousand in child support every month.

"Hello IRS? I have a dozen dependant extra-uterine children, that's cool right?"

[–] Ashyr 7 points 5 months ago

IRS is federal, so this would only be relevant on the state level.

[–] _haha_oh_wow_ 34 points 5 months ago (3 children)

"Hey, let's criminalize miscarriages!"

-GOP politicians across the country

[–] [email protected] 9 points 5 months ago (1 children)

I'd say don't give them ideas, but they're already planning for that.

[–] _haha_oh_wow_ 7 points 5 months ago

Yep, I was referring to that lady from Ohio. They eventually dismissed the charges, but still wtf?

[–] prole 2 points 5 months ago

That's the idea... They aren't worried because they know that rules like that don't apply to their class.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 5 months ago (1 children)

They already have in some states. If a woman comes to the emergency room with signs of a miscarriage, they are supposed to ask her if she has taken any abortificants and if she answers in the positive it’s a crime.

[–] _haha_oh_wow_ 2 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Yep, that's what I was referring to: At least person was already charged (though the charges were later dismissed).

[–] [email protected] 2 points 5 months ago (1 children)

we had a woman here charged with murder because she got shot and miscarried

[–] _haha_oh_wow_ 1 points 5 months ago

She's not the only one.

[–] [email protected] 28 points 5 months ago

Does this mean embryos are dependents? And if you have 20 frozen embryos you can claim them all on tax documents

[–] [email protected] 26 points 5 months ago (5 children)

It's getting really, really dangerous to have sex these days even in a LTR.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Granny sex. Post-menopause, no pregnancy. Plenty of nursing homes full of grannies ready and waiting.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 5 months ago

Ironically I just read an article about how unplanned pregnancies are skyrocketing amongst women in their 40s who assume they are done with menopause.

Not implying than 40s is "granny" but I thought it was interesting.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 5 months ago

Have you tried being gay?

[–] [email protected] 4 points 5 months ago

Yup, and even surgical sterilizations have failure rates.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 5 months ago (2 children)

Logic trunked radio?

[–] [email protected] 2 points 5 months ago

Fun system to use, not so fun when you're scanning the airwaves to be honest because many receivers have trouble decoding the talk groups in my experience.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 5 months ago

Loss trepidation reaction

[–] Aurenkin 1 points 5 months ago

LTRs aren't that safe now you really need to have it in a JPL or even TYD if you want to be really careful.

[–] [email protected] 20 points 5 months ago

Funny story. Nancy Reagan was apparently always personally ambivalent about abortion, but publically she was hard core Right To Life. That was until she found out embryonic stem cell research could help Ronnie's dementia. Suddenly, stem cell research was okay by her. Similarly, Right To Life advocate George W. Bush had no trouble endorsing a compromise that allowed some research to continue, because some embryos were more equal than others.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 5 months ago

Lawmakers think they know better than their constituents.

"They want to rule, not represent."

[–] [email protected] 10 points 5 months ago

A real race to the bottom with these guys

[–] [email protected] 4 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Republicans only pretend to value life when it doesn't cost them anything while they get to shame women.

They'll then insist to starve that poor child and blame the poor parents for that sweet, sweet dopamine hit of schadenfreude.

Their intent is entirely malevolent.

[–] [email protected] -3 points 5 months ago

THIS could do what abstinense only education couldn't, lol