I’m the chimney sweep now!
this post was submitted on 09 Jan 2024
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we just moved child labour to less developed countries. we didn't get rid of anything. you just don't see it, but child labour is still going strong in the world. child slavery as well.
No WE did not. The people in those countries where it still happens allowed it to still happen.
None of us have any decisionmaking power to control what those countries do, so the burden to fix those problems is on those countries who allow it.
It's 100% a consequence of Capitalism, though. You're blaming developing nations for the willful exploitation international Corporations commit and you personally benefit from.
That's just your opinion. The fact is that those developing nations should have child labor laws in place, and proper enforcement of those laws to prevent children from being exploited. The blame belongs squarely on those who allow it, and I reject any personal responsibility for any of that because I have no control over the laws of any country.
It is not my opinion that international corporations brutally exploit the third world, it's a fact. It is also not my opinion that Capitalism leads to this, the profit motive inevitably leads to it.
You claiming that developing nations should just fight against international corporations brutally exploiting them and absolving yourself of any responsibility you have for it is just sticking your head in the sand. If you aren't boycotting Nestlé, you're supporting them.
The "good" news is that there is no ethical consumption under Capitalism. You individually cannot do much, except protect, organize, and try your best to support less unethical companies whenever you can. However, to blame developing countries for corporations knowingly brutally exploiting them and offering no alternative is absolutely baffling.
Such an absurd thing to say. I’m sure you’ll win lots of hearts and minds with your absolutist take 🙄
Seriously! I mean, what if we only exploit a little bit of others' labor? Isn't that ok?
Sure, and when nobody wants to be a farmer in your utopia, you aren’t going to “exploit” anybody to fix that problem right?
I'm not exploiting you if we agree on a price for something.
What a way to say absolutely nothing.
If Capitalism is inherently exploitative, then there is no perfectly ethical form of it. Therefore, it should be replaced with a better system.
Do you imagine there is a switch somewhere? Like, right now we’re “doing capitalism” and tomorrow we could flip the switch and do something else?
Everything exists on a spectrum, and you won’t find anything like “pure” capitalism anywhere.
Id also disagree with the premise of it being inherently exploitative, but that’s a different topic.
No, I don't think you can just turn on the Socialism, Communism, or Anarchism button and do those. That's Utopianism. However, the idea that radical restructuring of society must be done via painfully slow iterative changes is also absurd and Utopian.
Capitalism is inherently exploitative, and that isn't a different topic. Complaining about me saying that there's no ethical consumption under Capitalism and yet saying you don't want to talk about why that's the case is just running away.
Capitalism is a bunch of mini-dictators competing, when we could have democratic and Cooperative control of industry instead.
Are you 14? You don't seem to understand how global trade works
I'm a bit older than that and have actually studied Macroeconomics at the undergraduate level. Have you?
Because a macroeconomics course is obviously going to be honest about this topic... Are you even serious?
We get it, you're white.. relax
Interesting take to assume developed = white and developing = not white.
I was referring to the rejecting any personal responsibility spiel. lol. I love how far off you were though
Yeah those countries just need to pull themselves up by their bootstraps and start being productive members of the world.
I know we could help them out so they don't have to go through all the hard times alone and without the knowledge we have, but fuck em hahahahahaha
But we are sharing knowledge and sending both aid and capital there. A lot of the countries are industrialized to the degree they are with the capital. Nobody acts in a vacuum these days.
We could be doing more for sure but we're not doing nothing.
That literally has nothing to do with what I was making fun of that guy for. He was arguing we shouldn't help at all. I was being sarcastic with him.
I agree with what you've said
It's a very complex issue, Western countries do a lot of things to help out less developed nations but we also do selfish things that makes life harder for them - unfortunately this is the reality of humanity, I am fighting my own personal ideological war against capitalism and the greed based system by which we live so I'm not defending it but it also has to be stated that other systems can have these flaws too.
We need a cultural shift to fix these problems, an economic one isn't enough on its own
The fact is that those developing nations should have child labor laws in place, and proper enforcement of those laws to prevent children from being exploited. The blame belongs squarely on those who allow it.
What a strange take. You’re saying that if I, as a business owner, am fully aware that my production chain relies on slave or child labor in another country, I bear no moral responsibility because “well that country should have stopped it”?
I didn't say any of that bullshit that you're trying to imply that I said. Those are your words only.
Comments like yours are a detriment to social media. Don't try to put words in people's mouths. That garbage is far too common and you just dumped yours here.
That’s precisely what you said, it’s nobody’s responsibility but that country. I merely pointed out an obvious example where your statement is false. Work on your comprehension skills.
Uh huh, I bet you definitely have bought something that is connected to child labor. Now, STFU, fool.
For the record, if you're in the U.S., there are plenty of children being exploited right here.
No you can shut the fuck up. You are getting a block shortly after you read this. You know it costs nothing to be polite instead of throwing around insults to people you disagree with.
Don't be a piece of shit. It's not that hard.
How dare someone point out things I'm ignorant of and don't understand as I make ridiculous claims about economic/foreign policy! Ohers have no right to criticize my unfounded, poorly-thought-out statements!!
Seriously though, you're totally not a fool. Imperialism and colonization are just buzzwords; they don't actually mean anything, so you have nothing to worry about
Funny how nobody wants to address the actual facts that I stated, that the burden of enforcing child labor laws is on the country that it happens in.
It doesn't fucking matter at all though, because nobody reading any of this can do any goddamn thing about it, and it will continue regardless.
Enjoy your dose of realism for today.
Colonization isn't real
yes we do. we demand money and offer that the only way they can make it is by exploitation.
Not sure who the "we" in this situation is, but I'm not demanding anything from them. They're selling shit and I'm buying. I'm not demanding products from them.
consumers are responsible for what they consume. pay and forget doesn't work
You said "we demand money", that's what I'm replying to. I (nor you in the comment I was replying to) didn't say anything about responsibility.
This is the opposite of outsourcing labor.
lets say america finds the cure for cancer, they only accept dollars. you have to get those dollars. welcome to the global trade.
None of this has anything to do with outsourcing labor other than that you'll have way more dollars than if you were a subsistence farmer.
if americans are using their time to find the cure for cancer someone has to produce food, someone has to mine the copper, someone has to etc... exploitation, the outsourcing of exploitation is a given in a capitalist system. if you are a subsistence farmer no cure for cancer for you in a capitalist system.
Pretty hard to export child chimney sweeps to other countries