were being punished that morning by Runions for not waking up the women and for eating Daniels’ food without permission
Any time a young child is in trouble for eating someone's food, it is a huge red flag.
Any time a child is responsible for an adult's schedule, it is a huge red flag.
This article is about child abuse that lead to murder.
Tragic
The headline really fucking buried the lede. This is not a story about a firearms instructor accidentally shooting someone. This is a story about extreme child abuse.
What kind of legitimate firearm instructor would allow a 4 year old to hold a gun. This was always about Child Abuse.
Remember that story recently with the teenage girl who ran away from her abusive parents after 16 years to save her (also abused) siblings? One of the things she talked about was getting punished for the same
Did you miss the part where it described the actual abuse? Like, you don't need to do much guessing to find out they were being abused.
Runions struck both girls with a sandal before forcing them to stand in different corners of the women’s bedroom
Runions pressed the barrel of the gun against the child’s chest and pulled the trigger, police said she told them.
Daniels told police that she saw Runions take out the gun, remove its magazine and put it to Evangaline’s chest, but she turned away and didn’t see her pull the trigger, according to the warrant.
This was a murder.
yeah it's 100% just a murder. probably she thinks by saying it's an "accident" she can either skate or get a manslaughter conviction instead of murder.
people do forget about the chambered round all the time.
But. I ain't holding my breath, either.
Yes, what the hell kind of gun safety lesson was that? Here is exactly what NOT to ever do.
Look, I'm one of the first to say Americans are dangerously obsessed with firearms, but this wasn't a firearms issue - it was straight up murder. This wasn't an attempt to teach with any sort of responsibility or following any safety at all. If anyone tried to teach my kids firearm safety by sticking the barrel in their chest they would be decked.
First rule - every firearm is loaded. Every. Fucking. Firearm. Is. Loaded.
That is a firearms issue.
Untrained, irresponsible people are getting access to guns.
I fully agree irresponsible people are getting access, but this goes beyond firearms and training. There is irresponsible ownership and use, and then there is putting a firearm in the chest of a child, right after removing a loaded mag and pulling the trigger. Using my car analogy - there is irresponsible not wearing a seat belt, and then there is putting a kid on the roof and going off roading. First one - training, laziness, responsibility and access issue, second one is straight up murder.
You understand this is simply another example of "people who should never have access to guns because they're too immature/angry/stupid" which is all anybody is asking.
There are a lot of crazy rednecks out there who are not safe with guns, we need a way to stop them specifically from having them.
And this enraged the gun lobby because many of them know that sometimes, they're that moron.
I say this as an extremely responsible gun owner.
Without taking a stance myself - I doubt anyone disagrees with the principle, but rather on the implementation. How do we know who's responsible enough; can we write a law that accounts for:
• A 50-year-old woman who committed robbery in a moment of desperation as a 16-year-old and has since shown remorse, attended therapy, and held a stable job,
• A 40-year-old businessman who's never been convicted of anything, seemed okay when he saw a therapist once last year, but privately he gets into vicious screaming matches with his wife and has really inappropriate temper tantrums when he's drunk, and
• A 21-year-old college graduate who seems smart and stable enough, but their social media page is full of harsh criticisms of the government, projections of what would happen if various officials were theoretically assassinated, and more than a few references to "hoping for another civil war"?
While balancing that with the idea that the government isn't supposed to protect something as a "right" while also preemptively taking that right away from people they think might be dangerous, if they can't point to highly credible evidence. (Otherwise, it becomes possible to arrest people for 'thought crimes.')
Idk the solution personally. Seems impossible to balance.
Not a firearm issue? Wtf killed her?
No wonder we'll never solve this issue. Idiots
Exactly. It was murder and its pissing me off the news is making it about firearm safety gone wrong. And the poor kids sound like they were abused in this foster care setting.. This girl was shot point blank in the chest. Hope there is some justice.This poor child.
I agree with your points, but I also think that if firearms were more regulated, this woman may not have even gotten a gun in the first place. We don't know her history, but if she did something like this, I wouldn't be shocked if she didn't have the cleanest of records.
temporary custody
Why is it next to impossible for people to get approved to adopt, but any asshole can become a foster parent? I think you need more in-depth screenings to adopt from pet rescues. If the US is going to force pregnancy on people, then they really need to get a handle on the foster system. Because it's always about "protecting the children," right?
Went through the foster care/guardianship in Oregon for us. These kinda stories make me Soo mad. I have a lot of First hand experience with the Oregon foster system.. I am adopted myself. I Was in 97 to a single woman in her late 50s (I loved my mom, make no mistake she was great and may she RIP) but it was super easy for her to adopt me.. like really easy...
THAT SAID... My husband and I also had to get custody of my nephew from my sister. It was a terrible experience and I almost warn people who are interested in being a foster because of our experience..
My husband and I went through hell and back in Oregon to be become foster parents just so we could take our nephew out of foster care. As we went through the process, We got accused of only wanting him for money by a foster care certifier. (mind you the amount they pay is pennies a month for a kid) God that woman was outrageous and we had to complain to my nephews case worker, that her co-worker was sabotaging our nephews chance at permanent placement and almost backed out because she made us look so bad for asking questions and curious about how to afford this child. Very relevant question to ask, wouldn't you say? (This foster certifier was very Catholic made it very know to me and my husband. She got upset with us when we told her we are not religious and had to tell us about all the Catholic churches and schools he should be in.... and at the time, we were also not married. (Gasp I know!!)
So she put in her report, that she was suspicious of us and our reasons for being interested in this child for suspicious reasons. This was my nephew!! I was there when he was born and everyday since till he went to foster care. My mom died.in 2020 and my sister couldn't parent without her support.. I wanted him home.. it was that simple!! But this worker made It a fucking nightmare and I was sooooo angry.
Thanks to his case worker appealing for us and showing the judge the errors the certifier was claiming we finally got the foster parent certification and are now full fledged guardians of him and have yearly check ins.. it was a headache and almost impossible with how long it took...
So when I see stories like this and someone who got be a foster who clearly shouldn't be, INFURIATINES ME!!! we had to work so hard and show everything (not that it was a problem for us, we expected it) but to see those who didn't get held to the same standards and a kid gets hurt through negligence pisses me off!!
It's almost like a terribly under funded government system with horrible pay that can be soul crushing doesn't attract the best possible employees. I'm sure they know that woman is a horrible zealot who they'd love to replace. There's no one that wants that job though.
Social services in America are embarrassing. Like it's strait up shameful how bad our systems that are required for a functional society are ran. Reagan successfully demonized government spending as "wasteful" on anything a perfect American nuclear family wouldn't need. Now everything is shit and the answer to needing government assistance for anything is good luck.
Just another reason why not every idiot and his uncle should be allowed to own a firearm.
For people who, like me, saw the gap between "teaching firearm safety" and first degree murder, the method outlined in the article for teaching firearm safety seemed to involve putting the barrel of the gun to the child's chest and pulling the trigger. The witness, the other child living in the home, says that the killer did pull the magazine before the 'safety lesson' though. Technically this might make premeditation difficult to prove and could hinder a first degree murder conviction but I also think that a jury will figure out some way to make this monster go away forever regardless of what the letter of the law says.
I mean, IANAL but I think it's pretty easy to argue that anyone with the bare minimum knowledge of firearms and intent to teach safety would know that:
You presume the gun is always loaded.
You check the chamber, even after pulling the mag. And then still treat the gun as loaded.
You don't start the lesson by putting the barrel of the gun to anyone's chest and pulling the trigger. Because you don't do that when treating a gun as if its loaded.
With those three points, which again, I would argue constitutes the bare minimum to anyone attempting to teach firearm safety, a skilled prosecutor could argue there was some sort of intent. She would have known those things, yet didn't do those things, and so behaved in a way that indicates other intent. Easier to argue manslaughter, of course, but it's just so egregious I can see why they'd push for 1st degree.
The standard for first degree murder is higher than the mens rea required for most crime. It's not just an intent to kill, it's a premeditated plan to kill.
I think they pushed for first degree because most people see murdering a child as the most bad murder you can do and first degree murder as the most bad murder charge you can convict someone of. To do any less would invite political attacks for being "soft on crime" but I think it's a lot to try to argue that this person must have intended to kill this child because no one could possibly be that stupid. Any time I've ever thought "no one could possibly be that stupid and cruel" I've been unpleasantly surprised.
There is a serious issue with child abuse here.
But, if you can correctly guess the country where this occurred before reading the locale in the article, then it's a telling point about how famous the idiots+guns connection is in exactly one affluent country while still being a tangent.
This is reason #9,278 why conservatives should not be allowed near children.
And reason #53759742269743 why guns should be extremely restricted.
Very upsetting story. This young girl was failed by every adult in her life.
You wanna teach firearm safety to a four year old, keep your guns safely locked up and practice using a hose pipe. If that murderer beams you with the hose, don't let them have your gloc because they gunna Bury you.
Do not begrudge getting older...so few get the opportunity.
4 year old wiped off this world because a 25 year old woman shot her in an attempt to intimidate and scare her. there was no firearms safety class being taught; if my mother wanted to "show me something" it was always to rub my nose in the proverbial piss of some mistake i had made in her eyes. That is what i see here for this "gun class"
These fucking backward degenerates should not be allowed to touch guns.
The 7-year-old girl told authorities that she saw Runions shoot Evangaline and said the bullet struck a glass bottle, sending shards her way, according to the warrant.
It's even crueler for the child that witnessed the murder. At least the girl who was killed doesn't have to continue to suffer. The 7-year-old who had to see it is old enough to remember that trauma for fucking forever. She's going to need so much therapy to overcome this incident and our system won't provide it for free.
Fuck anyone who brings out a gun around children.
what a piece of shit headline. the girl was being punished or the lady was trying to scare her and the gun went off. the 7 year old said that they were being punished for waking someone up and eating food?! this is probably a foster parent situation. I sure as fuck hope that 7 year old is placed in a new home!
showing someone gun safety is the killers excuse, thats not what happened here at all.
AND FUCKING 4 YEAR OLDS CANT EVEN TIE THEIR SHOES! WHY WOULD YOU GIVE THEM GUN SAFETY?
FUCKING HORRIBLE
This was a murder, plain and simple. She put a gun up to the girl's chest and pulled the trigger.
The gun safety lesson here being "see what happens when two meth heads with children in the house are allowed to have a gun"...
Was gonna come in here to say "The first rule of gun safety is your gun is always loaded, even if you cleared it and the safety is on, so barrels don't get pointed at anything you don't want to die".
This still applies here, but the situation had nothing to do with teaching a kid. Now that kid is dead. So fucked...
It is too easy to get a driver's license in the US and sure is hell way too easy to get a gun. Some people can't be trusted with a toothbrush.
According to a Tennessee Bureau of Investigation arrest warrant obtained by HuffPost, Runions told police that she had taken a 9 mm handgun out of its case, removed the magazine and called Evangaline over to “show her firearm safety.” Runions pressed the barrel of the gun against the child’s chest and pulled the trigger, police said she told them. Daniels told police that she saw Runions take out the gun, remove its magazine and put it to Evangaline’s chest, but she turned away and didn’t see her pull the trigger, according to the warrant. The 7-year-old girl told authorities that she saw Runions shoot Evangaline and said the bullet struck a glass bottle, sending shards her way, according to the warrant.
wtf
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