this post was submitted on 11 Apr 2025
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Science Memes

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[–] [email protected] 153 points 1 month ago (3 children)

This is also why hunting vests are bright orange. Easy for humans to spot, and deer get confused by there being a fucking tiger loose in New England.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Apparently pink works as well, if a hunter wants a second color vest

[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 month ago

That works on the same principle, except the deer thinks you're a panther.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 month ago

I always wondered about that, thanks.

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[–] [email protected] 86 points 1 month ago (7 children)

So was it just random that their fur is orange and not green? As both would help hunt prey just as well. Or is the advantage of being orange, that it wards away other tigers and predators that might otherwise muscle into its territory and create conflict.

[–] [email protected] 182 points 1 month ago (6 children)

It’s also orange because mammals can’t produce green pigments, so orange is the next best thing if your prey is red-green colorblind.

[–] [email protected] 102 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (3 children)

Our primary outer protein is basically keratin, which can be tinted orange(carotene), beige (collagen) or brown/black (melanin).

The green pigment is a byproduct of bilirubin catabolism, which we don't have because we use a different pathway to metabolize and recycle it.

[–] [email protected] 47 points 1 month ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 month ago (1 children)
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[–] [email protected] 34 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (3 children)

This is probably an example of natural evolution/selection where tigers that had slowly evolved more orange in their fur naturally, were able to feed more. This in turn meant the orange triat in their genes was passed on more frequently and became more dominant in the population.

In a sense it was probably a "random" mutation, but when it became useful and effective it was passed down quicker.

[–] [email protected] 29 points 1 month ago (1 children)

This is how evolution works. People often imagine some sort of logical system to it, but it really is just random mutations all over, with the advantageous ones propagating. There were probably a bunch of tigers with various odd colors or patterns at some point due to random mutations, but those evidently were less useful for hunting and reproducing than how they look now, so they died out in competition with the known variants.

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 month ago

But deer vision is immutable god creation. Checkmate.

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[–] pelespirit 14 points 1 month ago (4 children)

Are there any green animals that aren't reptiles, birds or insects? That might be a clue.

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[–] dnick 10 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Probably both, except within the bounds of easily 'random' bounds. Supposing it were possible for a mammal to be green, it wouldn't matter of green were 'better', unless it happened at the right time. Orange could have won out simply because it was good enough to do one thing (camoflauge for pretty) and didn't have enough downside to message that benefit (high visibility to hunters or less valuable prey). Heck, a gene that turned a lion invisible could have turned up and it wouldn't be guaranteed to carry forward even if it didn't have any downsides if the random recipient also happened to be clumsy or unlucky and died of some random injury or disease.

Evolution doesn't really have any tools that aren't random, at least until intelligence came around to provide other 'non natural' paths, though of course those are just as natural as the others, just that we think we're special and above nature.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 month ago

Yellows and browns and orange are a lot more related, and whatever color the pre-orange tiger ancestor was, it was almost certainly one of those.

Natural variation in the coat means some of those tigers were more orange than their peers. This trait was selected for.

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[–] [email protected] 80 points 1 month ago

Meanwhile my colorblind ass:

[–] [email protected] 59 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Do tigers themselves see themselves as orange, or are they genuinely surprised when humans easily spot them hiding in the grass?

[–] Tar_alcaran 41 points 1 month ago

My cats are surprised both by me seeing them sitting on an empty floor, and by other cats who they didn't see sitting on the floor.

So I can only conclude the answer is semi-perpetual amazement.

[–] [email protected] 24 points 1 month ago

They do not, like almost all mammals they are dichromatic! It's mostly us and some primates that can see in three wavelengths. Although interestingly enough, fish and birds can see in four wavelengths. Makes me wonder if that contributed to smaller cats being mostly gray and black, to just reduce as much light as possible?

[–] [email protected] 47 points 1 month ago (1 children)

The green image of the tiger is terrifying. You wouldn't see it until it's eyes or teeth were baring down on you in a lush green forest. Thankfully humans weren't it's main prey and therefore it likely evolved to appear orange instead...

[–] [email protected] 42 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (2 children)

Umm, I've met tigers.

You need to explain to them that we're not prey, but they haven't figured it out yet.

[–] tja 22 points 1 month ago

I think the key word is "main".

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 month ago

fish are friends not food.

[–] [email protected] 41 points 1 month ago

Tigers are generally crepuscular which means they’re most active around dawn or dusk, when the sun is very low in the sky. Their orange fur does not stand out so well when everything looks orange under the golden light of dawn.

[–] [email protected] 38 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Thank you, evolution, for allowing me to see orange so I can get an head start and outrun a mother fucking tiger!

[–] [email protected] 32 points 1 month ago (3 children)

outrun a mother fucking tiger

You only need to outrun your travelbuddy.

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[–] [email protected] 32 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Is that why cats can be so ginger and still good hunters? My orange stands out so much in the garden, but maybe to dichromatic mice he's super stealthy?

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[–] [email protected] 29 points 1 month ago (14 children)

Wouldn't a mutation in the deer sight to see orange be vastly evolutionary beneficial?

[–] superniceperson 29 points 1 month ago (4 children)

Only in areas with tigers, and then it would only express itself enough if there were enough evolutionary pressure exclusively on that survival tactic.

As long as other causes of death happen to deer in tiger territories and as long as speed remains a good survival strategy, minor mutations that would only provide an advantage in extreme specific scenarios like a tiger stalking them wouldn't have a chance to be spread.

There's also a whole host of additional brain power that needs to be dedicated to more complex colour blending and processing, and that may add enough delay to offset any potential gain in recognizing a threat.

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[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 month ago

It could, but it might also lead to something harmful for the deer at the same time. I'm not sure if the gene affecting the deer's eyesight is known, but it could be a pleiotropic gene (a gene that influences multiple traits at once).

If that's the case, and the other effect is negative and somehow spreads through the population, it could become a future issue for the deer. Think about humansβ€”we lost the ability to produce our own vitamin C. Almost every other mammal can produce their own (except for hamsters). When this happened, it didn’t harm us right away, so it spread through the population. But over time, it led to issues that weren’t a problem before, like scurvy.

Same could happen to the deer.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 month ago

It's been far more important, evolution wise, to be agile and quick enough to avoid predators. Like a security camera can only tell you how someone was murdered.

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[–] [email protected] 21 points 1 month ago (3 children)

Do the tigers know they are orange?

[–] [email protected] 21 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Do humans know tigers are green?

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[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 month ago (2 children)
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[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

No, they too are dichromats

[–] [email protected] 19 points 1 month ago (4 children)

Desperately need me a community just for tiger facts like this and pictures of tigers. Greatest of the Big Cats

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Thank you for subscribing to Big Cat Facts

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 1 month ago

Oooh I just thought nature was fucking stupid

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 month ago

Almost like our eyes evolved to give danger its own colour.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 month ago (1 children)

This must be utterly terrifying for them.

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Would not green be the obvious route then?

[–] [email protected] 15 points 1 month ago

AFAIK green is more expensive to produce. Plants use it since it's good at absorbing sunlight, but what's the advantage to a tiger, if their prey can't tell the difference?

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