this post was submitted on 19 Mar 2025
1483 points (98.4% liked)

Not The Onion

15221 readers
2637 users here now

Welcome

We're not The Onion! Not affiliated with them in any way! Not operated by them in any way! All the news here is real!

The Rules

Posts must be:

  1. Links to news stories from...
  2. ...credible sources, with...
  3. ...their original headlines, that...
  4. ...would make people who see the headline think, “That has got to be a story from The Onion, America’s Finest News Source.”

Please also avoid duplicates.

Comments and post content must abide by the server rules for Lemmy.world and generally abstain from trollish, bigoted, or otherwise disruptive behavior that makes this community less fun for everyone.

And that’s basically it!

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
 

In the piece — titled "Can You Fool a Self Driving Car?" — Rober found that a Tesla car on Autopilot was fooled by a Wile E. Coyote-style wall painted to look like the road ahead of it, with the electric vehicle plowing right through it instead of stopping.

The footage was damning enough, with slow-motion clips showing the car not only crashing through the styrofoam wall but also a mannequin of a child. The Tesla was also fooled by simulated rain and fog.

top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] [email protected] 8 points 7 hours ago* (last edited 7 hours ago) (1 children)

I saw the video and I have two points:

  1. Yes it plays like an infomercial for lidar. So take that portion with some skepticism. I can think of some issues exclusive to lidar like 2+ lidar cars blinding each other which needs to be solved, e.g. some kind of light pattern encoding to mask out unwanted signals.
  2. It absolutely 100% demonstrates the issue with camera-only technology in Tesla vehicles.

Teslas used to have cameras + radar but they cheaped out and removed the radar. I think it would have passed all the tests if they still had the front facing radar but they don't. The problem with cameras alone is obvious - they can't see what they can't see and probably don't have an innate sense to slow down if there is rain, fog, ice or whatever else that might cause a human to.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 4 hours ago

Are there no standards for minimum required sensors on a car to get a "self-driving" badge?

Every other field, especially in the automotive industry, has such strict standards.. Radar should be a minimum

[–] [email protected] 13 points 9 hours ago (2 children)

Of course it disengages self driving modes before an impact. Why would they want to be liable for absolutely anything?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 4 hours ago

The car accelerated to 80mph in its own? At least it's partly responsible..

[–] [email protected] 3 points 7 hours ago (1 children)

It’s a farce that this protects them from any liability

[–] [email protected] 3 points 7 hours ago

It doesn't guarantee them protection from liability, but it makes it easier to muddy the waters.

They never have to claim that autopilot or self driving was on during a crash in any comment to the press, or the courts. They never have to admit that it was directly the result of the crash, only that it "could have" led to the crash.

It just makes PR easier, and allows them to delay the resolution of court cases.

[–] [email protected] 19 points 10 hours ago (3 children)

I can’t wait for all this brand loyalty and fan people culture to end. Why is this even a thing? Like talking about box office results, companies financials and stocks…. If you’re not an investor of theirs, just stop. It sounds like you’re working for free for them.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 7 hours ago (1 children)

I can’t wait for all this brand loyalty and fan people culture to end.

My blackest pill in my adult life was the realization that we've leveled off as a species. This is as good as it gets.

Our brains made monumental leaps in development over the last half-million years, with the strongest changes being made during the last ice-age, times when resources were scarce, and survival was extremely difficult and humanity was caught up in many wars and fights with other humans and animals and weather alike. Our brains were shaped to do a couple of things better than others: invent stories to explain feelings, and join communities. These adaptations worked amazingly, it allowed us to band together and pool resources, to defend each other and spot signs of danger. These adaptations allowed us to develop language and agriculture and formed our whole society, but lets not forget what they are at heart: brains invent stories to explain feelings, and we all want social identity and in-group. Deeply. This shit is hardwired into us.

Nearly every major societal problem we have today can be traced back to this response system from the average human brain to either invent a story to explain a discomfort, and those discomforts are often the simple desire to have a group identity.

Our world will get more complicated, but our brains aren't moving. We can only push brains so far. They're not designed to know how to form words and do calculus, we trained our brains to do those things, but our systems are far more complicated than language and calculus. Complex problems produce results like lack of necessities, which create negative feelings, which the brain invents stories to explain (or are provided stories by the ruling class.)

So this is it. Nobody is coming. Nothing is changing.

We MIGHT be able to rein in our worst responses over enough time, we MIGHT be able to form large enough groups with commonalities that we achieve tenuous peace. But we will never be a global species, we will never form a galactic empire, we will never rise above war and hate and starvation and greed. Not in our current forms at least. There's no magic combination of political strategies and social messages that will make everyone put down their clubs and knives.

This is it, a cursed, stupid primate on a fleck of dust spinning around a spark in a cloud of sparks, just looking at every problem like it's either a rival tribe or a sabertooth-cat hiding in the bushes. Maybe if we don't destroy ourselves someday our AI descendants will go out into the larger universe, but it certainly won't be us.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 5 hours ago

Well said. Thank you for sharing. This is a nice piece to help those to self reflect once in a well, it feels….. grounding. Curious what the positive sequel would be…

[–] [email protected] 5 points 9 hours ago

I think it comes from Depression era kids who found a brand that didn’t create cheap junk and so they spread the word. But of course, that has been co-opted by capitalist pirates who buy a brand famous for quality, gut expensive manufacturing with the cheap alternatives and then count on making a profit before word-of-mouth catches up to them.

Sears retailer. Gibson guitars. Off the top of my head. Thousands more examples over the years.

My guess as for why people do it today was because their grandparents or previous generations did that as a survival necessity but now we are seeing the behavior warped from its original purpose. Like opening and raising your right hand to show you had no weapon became a friendly wave hello nowadays. Maybe that’s not an analogous example but you should get the idea.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 hours ago

Brand loyalty is for suckers. But it's what brands prey on. They foster brand loyalty. And unfortunately there are a lot of suckers.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 9 hours ago

How are there still tesla fans?

[–] [email protected] 5 points 10 hours ago (2 children)

Man these cars don`t have a Radar ? Only eyes like most of the animals? Not even as a backup ? Not talking about Lasers, but Radar? Truck drivers, better not paint a scenery on the back of your truck.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 9 hours ago (2 children)

Allegedly they used to, but Musk felt that vision should be enough because humans don't have radar either and they're just fine.

https://www.drive.com.au/news/elon-musk-overruled-tesla-engineers-radars-cameras/

[–] [email protected] 3 points 7 hours ago

Tesla use to have radar I believe, musk over ruled teslas using Lidar and insisted on vision only. Lidar powered autonomous vehicles like Waymo are already cruising the streets unsupervised beating tesla.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 hours ago

A genius! For decades, all carmakers have tried to fix human errors and compensate for our lack of abilities. Then there’s Elon, cutting out technologies because "humans don’t have them."

[–] [email protected] 5 points 9 hours ago (2 children)

LIDAR generally works better at relatively short distances (like less than a km). Several other car companies are going with LIDAR and do alright. Musk thinks cameras with image recognition would be sufficient without anything else. It goes without saying that Musk is very wrong.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 hours ago

Yeah, he’s a total idiot. That decision has held them back from so much progress… and for what? Saving a negligible amount of money on a very expensive car. Nice.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 9 hours ago

Yes but i am not talking over a running system through AI, i only say as a backup for redundancy only, which takes control to save you and tells AI to shut the fuck up.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 hours ago

Mark Rober did a follow up interview here: https://youtu.be/W1htfqXyX6M

[–] [email protected] 8 points 15 hours ago
load more comments
view more: next ›