I might risk voting 3rd party if this election wasn't a choice between boring corporatists and 100% concentrated evil.
The stakes are just too damn high to risk letting Trump get back into the White House again.
this post was submitted on 19 Oct 2024
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That makes an assumption that all or a big majority third party voters would prefer Harris over Trump.
Just for clarifying the logic here.
These numbers are also lies. Trump won PA by 68,735, while Stein got 48,912. It's just misinformation.
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The numbers in this image aren't real.
Also, why would you assume that those people voting for Stein would have preferred Clinton over Trump?
Why would someone who agrees with the Green Party platform prefer Republicans to Democrats? I'm sure such people exist, but I expect they're a tiny fraction of Green Party voters.
Those totals match the wikipedia article exactly, so if they’re wrong, please update them.
I assumed Stein voters were stupid and/or reckless but not evil. Perhaps you’re right though.
If this were true then American politics really are terrible. Minority should hold seats. America needs to revisit representation.
It’s actually not entirely true, it only counts stein as the only 3rd party (the libertarian candidate in PA got 3x as many votes as her, I’d bet those 3rd party votes wouldn’t have gone to Clinton) AND doesn’t report factual numbers.
It’s just not true.
That said unfortunately voting for a 3rd party candidate is largely useless in the USA and the forces trying to get their opponents voters to vote 3rd party are probably more overwhelming then the forces actually compelling folks to vote 3rd party.
FPTP needs to die in the USA.
Yeah, the numbers in PA are just wrong. Trump beat her by 68K and Stein got 48K. Even if Stein hadn't been on the ballot and every single one of her voters went to Clinton, she still would have lost PA and the Electoral College. This entire post is just a lie.
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Cool lie, dude! These numbers are all at least slightly off. In Michigan, Trump won by 11,612, and Stein got 50,700. In Wisconsin, Trump won by 27,257, and Stein got 30,980. Most importantly, in Pennsylvania, Trump won by 68,735, while Stein only got 48,912, meaning even if every Stein voter in this graphic went to Clinton, Clinton still would have lost not only Pennsylvania, but also the Electoral College, with the final total being 280 to 258.
Given that this is at least the second time this user has been caught spreading disinformation through fake infographics, we should all be more skeptical of their posts. They clearly either don't know or don't care about reality.
See how that says "99.8% reporting"? If you look at the NYT, it shows the results after counting 100% of the votes, and it matches what's in the picture.
This should be top comment.
It's incorrect. Look at the NYT. The difference is that Politico's numbers weren't updated after the final votes were counted.
Honestly, the post should be removed. Misinformation is a violation of Rule 2. Given that the user keeps doing it, a temporary ban is probably in order too, but that's the moderators' call.
North America’s electoral systems are so broken. It’s painful to see so much negativity, frustration, and fear directed at third parties in general. If that same energy was directed towards building a ranked choice voting system with proportional representation, like single transferable voting (STV), the duopolies would crumble and we could all actually vote for whoever we want without having to worry we might end up with the worst candidate winning.
That's great. I Agree.
We got four more years to do that, if Trump doesn't win.
We've had tons of time to change voting systems.
All the third parties couldve banded together to get it done. Ya know. With all their existing seats of power in federal, state, and local government.
Oh wait.
Hint. Hint.
A third party would be worthless if it won federal office right now. It would be roadblocked every step of the way.
I agree that our voting system needs an overhaul. But don't try to do it by electing a third party president. It'll never work, and if it did, they would be falling flat on their face for four more years and paint a terrible picture for the future of all third parties.
A protest vote means absolutely nothing, except that it helps the least-aligned primary party power. You are bolstering your opponent to do so. Literally cutting off your nose to spite your face.
It doesn’t need to start with the federal level. There’s a growing amount of states that have already adopted some form of ranked choice voting and some of those have also adopted a proportional variant. Progress is being made in some places at lower levels, but it’s slow. Other states have banned it unfortunately.
So then what is to be gained by voting for Stein? A clean conscience about the atrocities abroad?
That's cool. Remember that when there are even more atrocities here against your brown and LGBTQ neighbors, while the atrocities abroad dial it up to 11.
Remember that when there's more middle-class homelessness because there's not enough contractors with all the deported. Or not enough food when there's no immigrant labor to tend to the fields. Certainly not enough domestic labor to keep the farms running along with everything else.
Assuming their original country takes them back. If not, they stay here as detainees. Now we are paying to host them in the prison system. But, at least since illegal immigration is a crime, they can essentially be near-free labor thanks to the 13th amendment. Is that the right way to fix the housing crisis? Or lower the costs of food?
Not saying we can't be world police. That position benefits us greatly and give us tons of soft power. But maybe we should worry about keeping our own house from caving in on itself before we start trying to fix someone else's.
Honestly the idea that a real estate tycoon who is addicted to Big Mac's could fix the housing and food markets is laughably absurd. He'll fix 'em alright...just not in the direction most of his supporters are expecting.
Support ranked choice voting
I'll never forget what third party voting gets us; additional fucking choices beyond the dominant two-party system, encouraging broader participation. When a Republican or Democrat candidate loses any race, it's common to see them use third party candidates as a scapegoat.
Except it doesn’t. Not in presidentials anyway.
Do you vote separately for your president in the US?
In Germany we vote for Parliament, whoever receives a majority of votes then gets the governmental mandate and their candidate becomes chancellor. Many people thought there never would be any other chancellor than from either the "social" democrats (SPD) or "christian" conservatives (CDU/CSU, also just called "Union"), until 2021 when the Green Party got so good in surveys we suddenly had three official candidates.
I do know about the "electorial college" nonsense, just asking what exactly the votes are aimed to be for, government or specifically the president.
In the United States we vote for people not party. Every ballot is different depending on the year and where you live.
This November I will vote for
- President/VP
- 1 of 2 US Senate seats (the other will be voted on in 2 years)
- My US House Representative
- My State House Representative
- A county board seat
- A city commissioner
- Retention of certain judges
- A school board seat
- A board member for our water district
If I choose to do so I could vote for multiple political parties across the ballot. Which is great because I might agree with my local green party of local issues but still want to vote for Democrats nationally.
I would really like to see us remove the electoral college, implement RCV or STAR. And move towards more of a proportional representation system.
Edit: Also worth mentioning that how elections are run also depends on where you live. States actually control how their citizens elect a President, I believe 2 are using RCV this year. Some states also allow local communities to choose how they elect local officials.
Do you vote separately for your president in the US?
Yes, because they're the president not the prime minister(which is Speaker of the House in the US)
Primary Election, 1st Vote: One vote per voter to decide who represents the political party for the presidential election. Presidential Election, 2nd Vote: One vote per voter to decide who becomes the US President. The Electoral College and the stupid point system allows the minority vote to win. Yes, there are more names on the ballot for local government positions too. Technically, one could mix their votes with Democrat, Republican and other party candidates on the ballot.
I prefer the German voting system because it is based on the majority vote. FYI, I am allowed to vote in both Germany and USA.
Hey, just because it hasn't happened yet doesn't mean it won't.
- a terrible gambler
Ahh the illusion of choice. You vote third party and get another Trump presidency, but hey at least you got your morals, eh?
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