As someone who's used android literally since the first android phone was released, it's a massive disappointment how locked down and enshittified it's become.
this post was submitted on 17 Nov 2024
61 points (77.0% liked)
Privacy
32424 readers
490 users here now
A place to discuss privacy and freedom in the digital world.
Privacy has become a very important issue in modern society, with companies and governments constantly abusing their power, more and more people are waking up to the importance of digital privacy.
In this community everyone is welcome to post links and discuss topics related to privacy.
Some Rules
- Posting a link to a website containing tracking isn't great, if contents of the website are behind a paywall maybe copy them into the post
- Don't promote proprietary software
- Try to keep things on topic
- If you have a question, please try searching for previous discussions, maybe it has already been answered
- Reposts are fine, but should have at least a couple of weeks in between so that the post can reach a new audience
- Be nice :)
Related communities
much thanks to @gary_host_laptop for the logo design :)
founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
We can all blame Google for that.
I am surprised it took you this long.
The next step in this evolutionary thinking is simple. Buying hardware specs is a fool's folly. I don't compare hardware. Ads and marketing are totally nonsense and not worth even a slight glance. The ONLY thing that matters is what open source projects exist and what hardware do they support well. This is how I shop. Open Source or F.O.
New motto: open source, open purse
Pay to play? Finance to FOSS.
If it ain't free, it ain't for me (if it ain't libre, no way)
All in all my conclusion after experiencing the same: Samsung wants to replicate the same level of surveilance Google has. So with a Samsung phone I need to degoogle AND to desamsung ...
it spreads anti-libre software
Lineage and a fork, DivestOS are very close to Graphene, and run on far more devices.
The search for perfection is the enemy of good.
I've run Lineage for years on some spare devices. Battery life is so much better without Google Services.
My most recent device (Pixel 5 with DivestOS) is averaging 1.1% battery consumption per hour over the last day. That included an hour of navigation, using Google maps with microG services.
One old device runs longer with DivestOS than it ever did with stock, and the battery has lost 40% capacity. That's how bad Google Services eat battery.
Plus Lineage permits you to use a number of old devices, unlike Graphene. It's good, it gives you far more control than Google.
My final thought on Graphene - it needs to be taken over and lead by some professionals. Those folks act like stereotypical geeks of 30 years ago, arrogant, condescending (I worked with their type 30 years ago, and was a little like them then). They also denigrate anything less than what they deem "perfect". The very definition of hubris.
Their attitude is "if you have a problem you must've done something wrong, why did you do something wrong". Having that experience with them has put me off Graphene permanently.
Edit: I can re-lock the bootloader with Divest, so the condescending Graphene folks are just plain wrong about being the only OS that can do this. I don't lock it, because my threat model doesn't require it. The odds of my phone being grabbed by someone with state-actor-level skills being after me is non-existent, and there are easier ways to get the same data from me.
Yup, divestOS allows for booloader lock though unfortunately they don't support microG. I hope they somehow help upstream their relock solution to LOS. I use LOS for microG instead, since I need stupid bank apps and also for the office some stupid proprietary multi factor authentication apps... If only LOS for microG could lock the bootloader at will (it needs to be unlocked for major upgrades, like on regular LOS), that'd be great.
There's as well CalyxOS, which uses microG and also locks the bootloader, however I do prefer LOS since the strategy from CalyxOS and GrapheneOS trying to deGoogle pure Android in my mind sound like having some limitations, as opposed to LOS approach to be based on AOSP instead. Though that's just in my mind, I'm sure those guys in Calyx and Graphene are the best at security and privacy.
That's only as long as you have money for a Pixel (and most people don't).
The a series is pretty good bang for your buck, if you can't afford that and neither used ones, then maybe you could settle for one of the cheaper Asian ones supported by Divest OS
Exactly - I'm still very happy with my 4a. A used 5, 6 or 7a would be very cheap and very usable.
I've bought used phones since 2013. The most I've ever paid is $150, and that was recently for a Pixel.
You can pickup a Pixel 4 for about $100.
Surely "most people" are paying far more for their phones.
Old second hand Pixels are pretty cheap but they don't receive Graphene updates for very long.
Pixel 4 is past EOL with Graphene (and google)
Genuine question because I've been out of the loop on this. I had a Galaxy S5 that only got one major upgrade from Samsung (4.4 to 5.x I believe) but CyanogenMod and later LineageOS took that thing right up to Android 11.
Why can't the same be done with modern phones today? What changed between that old S5 and the Pixel 4a I ultimately sold for going EOL on GrapheneOS?
Edit: apparently I shouldn't compare apples to oranges without so much as quickly checking support for the Pixel 4a..
The kernel started moving faster, but also the kernel for these devices are orphans. They can never be updated properly because the source code for the kernel modules is not available. The way the phones get updated in ROMs is by back porting changes from the present back to the old orphan. It requires someone super familiar with both kernels to do so. Eventually it becomes untenable. The whole scheme of Android is centered around this source code/orphan kernel scheme. Everything is setup so that hardware manufacturers never have to add their source to the mainline kernel meaning you can never own the device. There is not a single phone or mobile device that you can completely own and running on mainline with available source code. The pixel is all about the TPM chip.
I got a refurbished Pixel 7A for $220 just to mess around with GrapheneOS. It’s a very affordable phone.
335 eur new on Amazon.
The biggest problem is the scarce availability outside the US.
Or should I say, that the biggest problem is software (OS) compatibility with other devices than the Pixel?
My money is on the latter.
Most people have no problem paying more for an iPhone.
most rich people*
Rich?
So only the half of the US that buys iPhone's is rich?
Or is it they don't know what they're paying because it's part of the monthly bill?
Most of the iPhone users I know are in their 20's and make less than half of what I do... And I'm far from rich.
So only the half of the US that buys iPhone's is rich?
Yes. A lot of people worldwide are much less rich than that.
load more comments
(2 replies)
This is why I specifically pick phones that have custom ROM support. Then I don't need to install gapps and I just use fdroid
I used to use Lineage OS before without gapps and it worked flawlessly although it was few years ago. Give it a try.
If you liked LineageOS without gapps, than I highly recommend DivestOS. It is a soft-fork of LineageOS with significant security hardening and removal of proprietary binary blobs.
lets start the divestos wave, its somehow rarely heard of but has the support of lineageos with the hardening of (almost) grapheneos, and the principles of GNU.
It also has bootloader locking for some devices, which is a plus.
Ive been meaning to flash this onto my fairphone but the websites instructions are a bit confusing (I've installed calyx, eos and graphene on other phones)
I would avoid /e/os (and iode) because they are frequently behind on Android security patches. More information here: https://divestos.org/pages/patch_history
That's great if not having to use any proprietary apps depending on google services, including push notifications, since part of divestos unsupported stuff includes:
Google Apps or microG or Sandboxed Play Services are NOT supported.
Which is fine, if you don't need to use such apps. An alternative to /e/os, which now a days is actually murenaOS, is lineageOS for micro G, which does sort of monthly releases based on whatever is available as nightly releases on lineageOS. It does provide you with microG and also with F-Droid with privileged extensions installed and already set for you. This might be more suitable than divestos if in need for some such apps.
MicroG actually works on DivestOS. It is "unsupported", as-in the Dev doesnt want to put any significant time into development for Gapps support.
load more comments
(2 replies)
/e/os?
I really like /e/os and have been running them for almost 2 years now. But recently they are having infrastructure issues and I may be moving on from the project. Sucks since i am a paying customer (online ecosystem) of them
One of the worst names ever. Maybe also one of the worst launchers. Otherwise I really like it.
I personally use GraphineOS on my phone and Alpine on my laptop
How did you install it on a Samsung device?
Samy usually requires Odin3 to flash ROMs – which requires a m$ 4 pane trash shoot OS. I haven't used m$ since the Samy S3 Galaxy era, so things may have changed but I doubt it.
Check Heimdall instead.
I think I did at one point but it did not work for me. That was a long time ago though.
I used that a long time ago to flash Lineage OS on this here Samsung tablet. Still works fine.
I bought a phone for something like $20 which is very simple. It has no vibration. It has 65 KB of onboard storage. And it is not a smartphone. I don't even take it with me most of the time, because I know that nobody will call me anyway, so why bother. I use it very rarely. The most usage I have from it is calling, flashlight and maybe as a clock once every so often, since I have many actual clocks.
On the computer I use GNU / Linux. And I have no complaints.
So I don't understand why even bother with a smartphone in the first place?
PS: I would love to try Pinephone or Librem5 though.
I've always used Samsung phones but I'm not buying anymore.
Android Auto has a setting toggle to turn it on. "Unknown" apps or some bullshit.