this post was submitted on 08 Aug 2023
387 points (96.2% liked)

politics

19246 readers
2532 users here now

Welcome to the discussion of US Politics!

Rules:

  1. Post only links to articles, Title must fairly describe link contents. If your title differs from the site’s, it should only be to add context or be more descriptive. Do not post entire articles in the body or in the comments.

Links must be to the original source, not an aggregator like Google Amp, MSN, or Yahoo.

Example:

  1. Articles must be relevant to politics. Links must be to quality and original content. Articles should be worth reading. Clickbait, stub articles, and rehosted or stolen content are not allowed. Check your source for Reliability and Bias here.
  2. Be civil, No violations of TOS. It’s OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It’s NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
  3. No memes, trolling, or low-effort comments. Reposts, misinformation, off-topic, trolling, or offensive. Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
  4. Vote based on comment quality, not agreement. This community aims to foster discussion; please reward people for putting effort into articulating their viewpoint, even if you disagree with it.
  5. No hate speech, slurs, celebrating death, advocating violence, or abusive language. This will result in a ban. Usernames containing racist, or inappropriate slurs will be banned without warning

We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.

All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.

That's all the rules!

Civic Links

Register To Vote

Citizenship Resource Center

Congressional Awards Program

Federal Government Agencies

Library of Congress Legislative Resources

The White House

U.S. House of Representatives

U.S. Senate

Partnered Communities:

News

World News

Business News

Political Discussion

Ask Politics

Military News

Global Politics

Moderate Politics

Progressive Politics

UK Politics

Canadian Politics

Australian Politics

New Zealand Politics

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
 

Back during the first months of the Trump presidency, then-Ohio Gov. John Kasich made a prescient—if not entirely original—observation about his one-time rival for the Republican nomination: “You don't put an animal in the corner without the animal striking back, [and] you don't put a politician in the corner … without them expecting to strike back at you.”

Kasich was correct in his assessment of Trump’s approach to leading Washington, and it’s a strategy that’s re-emerged as the ex-President faces increasingly urgent risks coming at him from all directions. Luck, it turns out, is a finite commodity. And a ginned-up gerbil can do more damage than a complacent cheetah.

Trump is under indictment in three separate criminal cases and is out on bond. A fourth criminal case out of Georgia could come as soon as this week, and preparations underway in Fulton County sure look like prosecutors in Atlanta are bracing for a chaotic scene. The trials would derail Trump for weeks if not months at the exact time he would need to be pandering to voters. And, despite being atop the polls of Republicans looking to be the presidential nominee in 2024, the risks to both his frontrunner status and his freedom are real enough that it’s sending him spiraling in search of a distraction.

“IF YOU GO AFTER ME, I’M COMING AFTER YOU!” That’s what Trump posted on his Truth Social account over the weekend, prompting Justice Department lawyers to ask a judge in the case involving election interference to issue a protective order. The not-at-all-subtle warning was part of a litany of all-caps threats that brought to mind various unhinged stretches of posts when he used to frequent the platform previously known as Twitter. When Trump wasn’t complaining that he was a victim of a politically motivated prosecution (“WHAT THE DEPARTMENT OF INJUSTICE IS DOING TO ME IS THE SAME THING DONE BY THIRD WORLD COUNTRIES ALL OVER THE WORLD.”), he was going after the U.S. team for its loss in the Women’s World Cup, singling out star player (and Trump critic) Megan Rapinoe for an errant foot: “WOKE EQUALS FAILURE. Nice shot Megan, the USA is going to Hell!!! MAGA.”

Sure, Trump’s social-media footprint has never been a particularly sophisticated logic-based realm. But for the first time since he joined the presidential fray back in 2015, Trump sounds genuinely scared, like he finally seems to be realizing his luck may be unique but not limitless. His knack for defying political gravity has been evidenced since his first campaign, when any other nominee would have been felled by the same series of missteps, scandals, and self-immolation; Trump instead somehow rode the fire-engulfed dumpster all the way to the North Lawn of the White House.

Trump has long enjoyed lashing out at those he perceives as insufficiently loyal. No one has been immune, be they real challengers like Ted Cruz or Marco Rubio or just perceived threats, as were the cases of Pope Francis, George W. Bush, and Megyn Kelly. But these latest attacks, somehow, feel different in a changed environment that no longer guarantees fearful fealty from his rivals. Where he previously launched his rockets with abandon, he is now being more direct to respond to would-be usurpers.

To Trump’s credit, his reflex appears to be more tactical than in the past.

Take, for instance, Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis, the closest thing that Trump has to a rival for the nomination next year. While Trump enjoys a massive lead over the Anti-Woke Warrior from the Sunshine State, DeSantis has been working on retooling a failure-to-launch bid, and it seems like he’s rethinking his deference to Trump. In an interview that aired on NBC News this week, DeSantis for the first time finally stopped pussyfooting around whether Trump won in 2020. "No, of course he lost," DeSantis said. "Joe Biden’s the President." After more than 1,000 days of playing coy games and dodging any declaration about Biden’s legitimacy, DeSantis has finally concluded it is time to treat Trump like the man to dethrone.

DeSantis, who on Tuesday replaced his top political hand, had been walking the line. For months, the default has felt like a backhanded defense of Trump at every turn, living both in contempt and cower of the ex-President. But two weeks ago, during a swing through Iowa, DeSantis subtly jabbed his one-time self-considered patron. “I don’t consider myself to be an entertainer,” DeSantis said in Osceola. “I’m a leader. And that’s what you get for me, somebody that will deliver results.” The ceiling of the distillery where he spoke didn’t collapse, and DeSantis marched on. (Trump, naturally, told a conservative radio host that DeSantis should drop out for the good of the party.)

DeSantis’ footing—and Trump’s counter-punch—has seemed to grow stronger in recent days. Until recently, only former New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie has been an unabashed critic of Trump’s return to power, a lonely spot but one that is starting to have some pals testing its viability. After all, 78 looming felony charges gives even the most mild of candidates permission to at least raise the question of Trump’s true viability in a rematch against Joe Biden. “This election needs to be about Jan. 20, 2025, not Jan. 6, 2021,” DeSantis said in Waverly, Iowa, during that weekend bus tour.

Similarly, former Vice President Mike Pence—the one who spent four years as Trump’s loyal and self-censoring understudy—has started to rev up his critique of the ex-boss, and thus draw his ire. While Pence has hinted at his antipathy toward Trump and, in particular, his former boss’ conduct on Jan. 6, 2021, the intensity has increased of late. And not coincidentally, Trump has targeted more of his public attacks on Pence, as he realizes that his former vice president poses a real threat to his legal woes, given his first-hand access to the West Wing during the final weeks of Trump’s tour there.

Pence predicted Trump’s realization was coming, telling The New York Times on July 30: “I think we’re coming to a fork in the road.”

top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] C0unterfactual 40 points 1 year ago (6 children)

I hate to rain on this parade, but there's no guarantee Biden will pull it off in a rematch with Trump. It was way too damn close in 2020, and the MAGA base is as fired up as ever these days. The "sane middle," if it still exists, needs to turn out hard, because if Trump wins this thing, I for one our democracy is freakin' toast.

[–] [email protected] 19 points 1 year ago

Make sure to actually vote.

Too many people are too busy complaining about political threats and then forget to go vote on election day. The turnout rate in the US is incredibly low compared to other mature democracies. Vote! Local, state, national. Every time.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 year ago (3 children)

There was a recent article that mentioned that it might not be so close anymore due to the results of anti-vaccine politics and the effects it had on the death rate.

It was way too damn close in 2020

Due to electorial college and gerrymandering. Looking at the number of votes it wasn't close at all. There have been loads of articles regarding the illegal gerrymandering where in various cases the illegal ones were still kept as any change was blocked.

It's a close election because it's manipulated.

load more comments (3 replies)
[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

Definitely not guaranteed biden wins, but you have to admit trump is toxic. He directly helped lead to the republicans underperforming in the 2022 midterms, and his mere existence on a ballot energizes people to get out and vote against him. It's not looking good for the guy, and anything's possible, but I really don't think he will win.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

This even assumes Trump gets in the race. There's a lot of contenders right now, and some of them like DeSantis have a decent head of steam behind them. Sure, Ron doesn't have Donald's charisma and ability to work a crowd, but he's a lot more baldfaced as a fascist, and that might be what he needs if the GOP keeps playing the Culture War angle.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Desantis just admitted that Donald Trump lost the 2020 election. His campaign is over. Check his polling, it's been nosediving hard.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Nobody thought he would win in 2016 and if not for the anti democratic electoral collage he would not have.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago

even then there was a lot of stupid people who believed his bs that he spewed in every direction. He implied he would legalize weed on a federal level and something else that is usually very liberal. Then you had the democrats sink bernie and that did not help. All the same folks better vote like their lives depend on it if trump is a canidate.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago

Is there a sane middle?

Like does sanity exist on an entirely separate axis from stupidity and from ignorance, or can you be sane and stupid? I’m not sure, but I think sanity may be less relevant than competence.

I doubt you can be a competent voter in the middle. There isn’t really a compromise there, on any issue except maybe corporate welfare. Maybe you can be a reasoned centrist if you manage a hedge fund or something. Even then you are probably supposed to be sociopathically voting for tax breaks.

I have zero faith in the middle, and consider them all cryptofascists until proven stupid. Maybe that’s why both parties try so hard to court the centrist “swing” vote: they know centrists are enriched with gullible idiots.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago

I feel you about the sane middle. I am a Democrat and likely will vote for Biden regardless, but even the prospect of having a republican nominee like Trump, Pence, or DeSantis terrifies me. I really hope unenrolled, independents and moderate Republicans vote for almost anyone else in the primary. I think the mayor of Miami and someone from North Dakota (a senator?) are running. Don't know a ton about them but they seem less mean-spirited as far as I know. I just have this horrible imaginary scene in my head where the Republican National Convention has a remote telecast set up from Donald Trump's cell block. Or maybe there's an announcement that says "Our candidate must leave the convention early because he has a curfew with his house arrest." Or even Trump just excusing himself several times throughout the convention to return correspondence from his lawyers, the courts, or publicists. It would be so embarrassing for the party and to the country to allow a convict or near-convict to compete so closely for the highest office in the land.

[–] jscummy 29 points 1 year ago (4 children)

You'd think they'd be going for the kill in that case. Only one to show any bit of a spine is Pence, as shocking as that is

[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Only one to show any bit of a spine is Pence, as shocking as that is

dude, Pence was back to sucking trump's dick the moment Jan 6 was over. Like. he was afraid to get into a secret service SUV because he didn't know the driver and thought he might be getting dissappeared, and he's still protecting trump without stepping over any lines himself.

he's the epitome of a spineless coward. all of his comments on the matter have been non-asnwers, as well. The only thing that has any amount of spine is his "oh I took notes" but even that's a moral cop out.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I don't disagree, but the prospect of Pence testifying in open court during primary season is delicious, especially if they get this thing televised.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago

"Sir, why didn't you get in the truck?".... "you mentioned not knowing the driver. Why was that a concern? were you concerned you might be taken somewhere against your wishes?" is a question I'd love to hear him asked under oath. I don't think he'll give a real answer to that, though.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Chris Christie has been going hard on Trump for a minute. He is still a piece of shit, but I gotta give credit where it's due.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Trump almost killed Christie by giving him COVID knowing he was contagious and never even visited Christie in the hospital. Christie hates Trump.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago

So much crazy shit has happened, and I completely forgot about this. You're right, I think this probably pushed him over the edge, and now it is totally personal. It's one thing to call someone McCheeseburgers or whatever Trump called him the first time around, but Trump probably almost killed Christie for real. So, yeah, I understand why the gloves are off.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago

They all wand to normalize being above the law. So they are going to do an insane dance around the whole thing rather than condemn Trump for sedition. Pence it already pinned to saving the state so he really has to lean into it.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago

His spine will disappear again, I'm sure.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Thanks man. Very interesting times indeed

[–] [email protected] 22 points 1 year ago (3 children)

It really is very interesting.

It seems the Republican party has a conundrum. The only candidate capable of firing up their base is a candidate that also fires up a much bigger majority of Americans against them.

The game plan worked in 2016, but has failed ever since then.

Still, it seems they are going to stick with it for another go around...

Joe Biden is going to be the first octogenarian elected president, just because Republicans don't have a better alternative.

Really interesting times.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago

It seems the Republican party has a conundrum. The only candidate capable of firing up their base is a candidate that also fires up a much bigger majority of Americans against them.

the other issue they have is that if they dump the chump... then the chump will go full scorched earth and run anyhow.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago

Trump, the ultimate wedge issue.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 21 points 1 year ago (4 children)

It's beyond my comprehension that the Democrats aren't able to launch a candidate that is better and younger than Biden. I mean, Trump and Biden, are those the best GOP and DEMs have to offer?

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I understand the feeling but personally biden has accomplished some things and has others in motion where I would like him to have 4 more years to complete them. At least he does not roll over at every defeat and comes back at the issues from another angle.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I don't understand the obsession about Biden's age. He's done great work and had one of most productive terms in the last century. Look at all the bills he's gotten passed, the judges appointed! He lost some fights but those fights were probably not winnable if some other Democrat were in his place. Who gives a shit if he's old if he's still able to do the job?

Meanwhile it's a statistical fact that incumbents have an easier time getting elected than new people. It would be certifiably insane for the Democrats to put a new person up instead of an incumbent, it would be tantamount to throwing the election away. When the stakes are this high, why would they ever do that?

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago

Gerontocracy

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago

They are able to but they don't actually care about winning. They only care about keeping their gravy trains running

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 19 points 1 year ago

This is the best summary I could come up with:


Kasich was correct in his assessment of Trump’s approach to leading Washington, and it’s a strategy that’s re-emerged as the ex-President faces increasingly urgent risks coming at him from all directions.

“IF YOU GO AFTER ME, I’M COMING AFTER YOU!” That’s what Trump posted on his Truth Social account over the weekend, prompting Justice Department lawyers to ask a judge in the case involving election interference to issue a protective order.

His knack for defying political gravity has been evidenced since his first campaign, when any other nominee would have been felled by the same series of missteps, scandals, and self-immolation; Trump instead somehow rode the fire-engulfed dumpster all the way to the North Lawn of the White House.

No one has been immune, be they real challengers like Ted Cruz or Marco Rubio or just perceived threats, as were the cases of Pope Francis, George W. Bush, and Megyn Kelly.

After more than 1,000 days of playing coy games and dodging any declaration about Biden’s legitimacy, DeSantis has finally concluded it is time to treat Trump like the man to dethrone.

“He’s delusional, and now he wants to show he’s a tough guy,” Trump sniped at his former running mate, who testified for more than five hours before the federal grand jury back in April and spoke candidly about the events before and during the Jan. 6 uprising.


I'm a bot and I'm open source!

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 year ago

Not many contenders on the Republican side to Trump right now. Maybe things will change.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Haha. “Rivals.” Who, Pence? Please.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

To be fair, 8 years ago Jeb had a commanding lead. DeSantis may be polling double digits behind, but it’s not insurmountable. Probably insane to think anyone else could come from behind now.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Waiting for Tucker Carlson to declare.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago

Please don’t let Tucker see this post and get an idea he will call original.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

OT, but does anyone know what brand the presidential umbrella is? It looks like quality.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 1 year ago (2 children)

If it's the one from his arraignment, it's a trump branded umbrella that says "TRUMP" in gold letters on the side you can't see. Which, if it's anything like his other branded stuff, it's most likely crap, and you can buy one if you are easily parted from your money.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (4 children)

As evidenced by him simply discarding them when they prove too difficult to close.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wLkOl0aUsxE

load more comments (4 replies)
[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

I have pretty nice umbrellas already, but they don’t have the storm flap that one has. Mine are knirps brand.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 year ago (2 children)

They only thing the government should be issuing Trump is an orange jumpsuit.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

ankle cuffs, hand cuffs. waist and leg chains. oh. and laceless shoes... can't have the cheetoo taking the easy way out.

incidentally, I happen to know they make real handcuffs with pink cladding on them. They should totally give him pink cuffs.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I am no umbrella connoisseur, but I'd assume it's a golf umbrella with his branding on it.

I've always wanted to get one of the Kingsman 'brand' ones (which I think are London Undercover with a different logo), but I'm not out in the rain anywhere near enough to justify $200+ on an umbrella

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago

How many federal indictments should it take before I start worrying?

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago

Slow news day?

load more comments
view more: next ›