Reddit is like the restaurant you've been going to for several years that was a mom & pop operation with awesome food and atmosphere. It got popular, and the owners made it a chain, so you could get the same food in a lot of different areas. The quality started to go down as they expanded, but it was already very popular. Then the owners started raising the prices, and the atmosphere started to get way less awesome. At some point, you realized that it's not the restaurant you fell in love with, and it wasn't a good value anymore, so you started looking for a similar kind of restaurant that was more like that one was early on. But the chain is still really popular, and a lot of people just keep going because it's what they're familiar with and they know the menu - they don't want to go to the work of finding a new place and they're content with what they're getting there. The people who have left are a drop in the bucket so far, and the chain restaurant is likely to continue operating for the foreseeable future.
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There’s people who even think Reddit is right.
Because they think Reddit is Facebook.
This is just digg.com evac to reddit.com 13? years ago.
Step 1: Site thinks it owns content users created and made site what it is.
Step 2: ???
Step 3: Profit!
13 is the age of the account I deleted and I was in the Digg exodus, so yeah.
Same here. Went from Digg to Reddit, now to the Fediverse.
It will take time for the muscle memory to go away. I still type in "reddit" in the address bar, and probably will for some time to come.
The overwhelming majority of Redditors probably don't really know what the actual issue is, and on the surface, Reddit charging for an API that they've allowed free access to for years probably seems logical. Plus, people are creatures of habit, they'd rather go back to the same website they've been visiting, with the community that they already know, than try to figure out what the heck a Lemmy is.
Honestly, apathy. It is not like people have to start paying for the app or website explicitly
- Facebook/ Meta stole and continues to steal millions of users' data, the vast majority of the users do not care
- Twitter hacked most third-party apps, but people still use it because it doesn't affect them personally. They still use it for free, so why not?
- Reddit killed third party APIs? People will grumble, but they will recalibrate their mind and continue using the official app.
I completely agree, and I think another major factor is a function of when you started using Reddit.
I've noticed a trend that many of the people who've moved on from Reddit (or at least the ones who are posting here and in places like Hacker News) joined Reddit 8+ years ago.
I started using Reddit about 14 years ago, and I've definitely noticed a change in the overall vibe of Reddit over those years. There were obvious changes (like cracking down/banning specific subreddits) and there were more subtle changes (like communities growing so large that the comments turned to shit) and there was a departure from a text-heavy, original-content focused haven for like-minded people to a feed full of gifs and inflammatory comment (not to mention ads-that-are-pretending-to-be-posts).
People who have been using it for so many years notice this change, but it was so gradual and over so long a time that they were used to it -- essentially the change was slow enough that we were lulled into accepting the new reality of Reddit.
But then this whole kerfuffle has shaken us out of it and made us realize that it's only going to get worse. So here we are, onto greener pastures.
Now, on the other hand, we have the (many, many) people who started using Reddit more recently. They only know the "new" Reddit. And so they don't get what the big deal is. They think the mods are throwing a fit and the power users are just whiny and "why the hell can't I see my memes?".
They don't understand what we miss about Reddit.
I guess because there are a lot of people who just don't care. Look at Twitter, Musk could do what he wants Twitter still has a big number of users.
Also reddit has a huge and very active community. This is very hard to replace.
I disagree with twitter, I wanted to continue using it despite the issues but the tweets and replies I was seeing was such a drop in quality that it naturally phased out of my routine, which I've from others in person that felt the same.
Reddit is a sharper change for us, twitter kind of just declined out of being worthwile.
Sadly that is true. Most people "just want it to work".
The arrow of enshitification flys in one direction only. the people that are still there will migrate out eventually. spez was right when he said the majority of users don’t care about the api, but fails to realize that the majority of users don’t generate content. The users that do generate content are jumping ship.
Yeah, the majority of users don't care about the API because they don't know what it means - that it's the interface that enables not just third party apps, but also moderation tools.
The same users that will tell you that they don't care about the API will start whining when the moderation of their favorite subs turn to shit, when they get overrun by trolls and spammers and bots and advertising.
People just fail to connect the dots.
They are used to going to Reddit and have no interest in finding an alternative, when their community is there.
Too be fair, the fediverse is not easy to grasp for the average user.
Denial
Anger
Bargaining <-- they are here
Depression
Acceptance
Reddit Is Fun is one of the apps being killed off next week. Their subreddit was marking each post with which stage of grief it was. A lot of anger and Bargaining.
Because of what is WAS. While it still remains a bastion of information and data, for me Reddit has went WAY beyond a social media that I'll use. I was already done when they decided not to reconsider their API decision - I could have been swayed, too. Companies deserve to get paid for their data and service; but not price-gouging rates like Reddit is attempting. It really sucks, too - I loved what Reddit, and its USERS, provided to the userbase... when I heard about mgmt planning to forcefully take back BLACKOUT sub-reddits, tho; that was it. NO ONE should remain there - I don't understand how anyone could - federation is the only way forward, aside from going back to a website for every 'sub-reddit'... Lemmy and LemmyNet should, as they are, really take hold right now. The devs need to find more help; I hate to say this, but theres money there. NO REDDIT, NO MORE. MORE Social, less Media.
Reddit is unsalvageable and had been for a long time, but again, you are not going to be able to take the redditor out of people even if they move somewhere else for a long time.
None of us should be trying to build a better reddit here, we should be aiming to build something new, knowing what works and what doesn't from our time as redditors.
Something more sincere, I guess.
You're on the Fediverse where the more "extreme" people moving away from Reddit are. Hence, there is a strong bias toward experiencing the Reddit fiasco in a way that makes one think, that it's already a sinking ship. For many, Lemmy isn't as easily useable and mature as Reddit is.
I had hope until yesterday. I was a mod and all my users turned on me and said some really hurtful things. I'm gonna give a mod position to someone else on a smaller sub I'm a part of or two and step down from the rest. I'm guessing I'll still lurk, but I'm done with it.
I don't think people understand how important moderation is. I'm sorry you had that experience. I appreciate all the work you've put in.
Its the sane reason people still play old mmos. Theyve already sunk so much time into it and they are used to it, its were their community is and something new is uncomfortabke and scary.
Nah, we still play because we like them. I play oldschool Runescape because I can't stand Runescape 3. It has nothing to do with 3 being scary, I just prefer the mechanics of the old school version.
because the majority of people doesn't really care sadly
Denial, at least for me. I still have a hard time wrapping my head around the fact that anyone could be that stupid and eager to destroy it’s most active part of the user base…
And the fact that it’s Reddit, a Site I always preceived as community driven and kinda above those corporate shenanigans, I still have hopes some saner heads might prevail. Although that seems increasingly unlikely by the minute…
Reddit is a VC backed startup so this was always going to happen. I am surprised it took so long, to be honest.
Here's one way to realize why Reddit should not be taken seriously: Suppose that the head moderator position for r/politics was put up for open auction. How much would it sell for? It would be purchased by someone who was interested in controlling what information people see.
Subreddits are moderated on a first-come first-serve basis. If you were the first one to squat a name 10 years ago, you get to be the head moderator, even if someone else might do a better job. This is the "landed gentry" comment Reddit's CEO was referring to.
They don't see their niche interest groups migrating to a different platform.
Smaller subs may have had just enough critical mass when accessing the entire reddit user graf, but new platforms are not there yet. It is much easier to gain traction in a unified user base than in a federation of disparate user bases.
Reddit is profiting a lot from the network effect. By now this reddit is a known brand, has a lot of content is already there, has a lot of people (especially non-technical users) are already on reddit, and they're there to stay.
All the other reddit alternatives, including lemmy and/or the fediverse suffers from:
- Bugs (I love lemmy, but gosh, have you seen how buggy and sometimes unresponsive it is?)
- The complexity of "servers" (don't get me wrong, federation is the way to go IMHO, but it is confusing to non-technical users)
- Lack of content
- Lack of users
Everybody is talking about the Digg exodus, but nobody is saying that it didn't happen in a day, it took ~1 to 2 years.
We are losing a lot, this new ActivityPup fediverse is exciting but it is like going back a decade for long-term reddit users.
Reddit obviously sucks now and has been like this for years, IMO it was newReddit and its focus on Facebook users that was the biggest event declining quality. What we had slowly eroded and its no longer there, but there were still enough smaller active communities that it could still be a good experience.
We are rebuilding and it is fun and exciting, but we are losing a big part of our lives in the process, we wont have something equal to what we lost for a couple years to come.
I agree, as someone who saw reddit evolve from r/reddit.com to what it is today, it took about 4 years for them to really get to peak old reddit with the introduction of multireddits. Other than that most of the development has been in the third party apps, and really much of that development has been updating the apps to match the evolving OS design language rather than new reddit API endpoints. But we now have the advantage of having a minimum viable product and people with years of experience building and moderating communities.
I used to mainly use niche subs. The default subs are fucked. Same old one liners over and over, getting upvoted to oblivion.
The vast majority of reddits userbase are consumers. They are already using the official app and don't care about the politics of the platform. These people are only there to get their content fix.
I realised this when I saw a post on a subreddit where someone shared on how to turn off some kind of notification in the official app. So many other people thanked this person... Reddit has become another mainstream social media site like FB, Instagram and so on.
I have zero hope for Reddit. I had no idea there were much better 3rd party apps available for Reddit on phones, so the API changes don't impact me. But I've noticed over the years more and more, astro turfing by bots, bots reposting popular things to karma farm, as to sell the bot to entities looking to influence reddit via the aforementioned astro turfing.
It's all very gross, I started to feel like a duck sitting in a pond surrounded by ducks, but not really, they're all decoys, fakes, mean to give the impression of a big crowd. I don't like that trend, and on top of that, the idea of Reddit going public, and trying to push our content as their value makes me sick. The owners of reddit haven't done the heavy lifting, we the users, the mods all did the work and built up content. The idea that some chucklefuck was going to profit big from our effort isn't something I want to be part of any more. So here I am, and I gotta say, Lemmy feels like a 2000's forum by comparison, and I hope its very nature makes it harder to fall into the same pit falls as reddit and digg did.
Like it or not. The internet is evolving.
Personally, I just feel bad for Apollo's creator and mods (the good ones) who spent so much time carefully taking care of a community they love, so in a sense I wish Reddit would come to their senses and axe that fucker CEO and revert to reasonable API changes. But it's mostly wishful thinking. Besides, now I would feel bad if Reddit managed to go back to being good because that would mean that this aswesome Lemmy thinghy would go back into the shadows, while it deserves so much attention imho.
Some people like my bf just browse for a little bit of their communities and don‘t care about anything else.
However, if we make this place interesting enough they will come naturally, those sorts of people are like moths who are attracted to interesting content.
Most of the subreddits I used to frequent (particularly/r/manga) haven't made the move to anywhere, nor they blacked out in protest. While I see some parallels here, there's still very few active users. I would love to be able to post more content myself, but I objectively do not have enough time in my hands.
I don't have any hope for reddit, but unfortunately, it is stil a very good source of information. Plus some previously established communities cannot be easily replaced, so reddit still has a use for me.
I hope that with time, my old communities will find their way here. Until then, sometimes I need to use reddit to talk to some people and access information.
And this is what makes the whole situation so shitty. All of the popular social media sites suck, but it's not easy to replace them with something new when the majority of the content and community stays there.
I had hope until the infamous AMA posted by spez, and him doubling down on accusing people of blackmail. I've purged my account history immediately after that.
I can only repeat what I just commented somewhere else:
I built Swift apps and Mastodon or Discord are NOT a proper format to get help, Discord being crappy for archiving, too.
I have a hard time getting help by people that really know this stuff because Swift is made by Apple, and the Apple bubble tends to stick to Twitter and the likes. If enough migrate, I can finally say frick off, Reddit
Because the content that people dump into it for years and communities are valuable. May be if some of those communities migrated to lemmy and I just keep accessing contents from way back machine, then I may not want Reddit anymore, but at the moment. I wish for it's redemption
Honestly, it's a information goldmine. You'll get answers to most obscure questions and in detail. All others sources on the internet are either fluff or endorsements. It it also inconvenient to have to visit two websites that does same thing. So people don't want to abandon what they are habituated to.
some people still poop in holes in the ground.