this post was submitted on 16 Nov 2024
438 points (98.5% liked)

Technology

34981 readers
167 users here now

This is the official technology community of Lemmy.ml for all news related to creation and use of technology, and to facilitate civil, meaningful discussion around it.


Ask in DM before posting product reviews or ads. All such posts otherwise are subject to removal.


Rules:

1: All Lemmy rules apply

2: Do not post low effort posts

3: NEVER post naziped*gore stuff

4: Always post article URLs or their archived version URLs as sources, NOT screenshots. Help the blind users.

5: personal rants of Big Tech CEOs like Elon Musk are unwelcome (does not include posts about their companies affecting wide range of people)

6: no advertisement posts unless verified as legitimate and non-exploitative/non-consumerist

7: crypto related posts, unless essential, are disallowed

founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] [email protected] 57 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (3 children)

Calling zionism what it is shouldn't be discouraged with dog whistles masquerading as conduct policies.

At the same time I'd like to remind folks that not all Jewish people subscribe to Zionism.

There are a couple Jewish lead organizations that fight for the freedom of Palestine and have been very critical of Israel for many years.

Jewish Voices for Peace is one group. I wonder how they'd feel about Twitches new policy. I'm genuinely curious what their opinion would be.

Edit - corrected Jewish Voices for Peace

[–] [email protected] 31 points 1 week ago (1 children)

At the same time I’d like to remind folks that not all Jewish people subscribe to Zionism.

Further to this, the majority of zionists are christians.

[–] zqps 6 points 1 week ago (3 children)

I know there's a lot of Christians involved but how do we know it's the majority? Young Israelis are raised largely around Zionist propaganda after all.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 1 week ago (1 children)

There's about 100 million evangelical christians in the US, and a LifeWay poll in 2017 showed that about 80% essentially considered themselves zionists. That's 80 million. There's 15.8 million jews worldwide. So the non-Jewish zionists outweigh Jewish zionists by a fair margin. Heck, they outweigh the zionist and the non-zionist jews taken together by a beefy margin, even.

[–] zqps 0 points 1 week ago (1 children)

That's an insane number. Must be a very broad definition of Zionist.

[–] [email protected] -2 points 1 week ago (1 children)

oh no, statistics that challenge my world view! Quick, let's not look into it at all and move the goal posts!

Could you at least try to engage in this discussion? Or maybe come up with any evidence supporting your world view?

[–] zqps 0 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

A different definition of the term isn't a different worldview. Also, not immediately spinning every exchange into an exhaustive debate isn't a critical character flaw. Unlike being an insufferable ass about not getting the amount of attention you apparently feel entitled to.

Though I would take look at that poll about 80% of Christians being "essentially" Zionists if you'd link to it.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 week ago

the majority of zionists are christians.

us braindead fundies are numbered in dozens of millions and they largely support Zionism.

in rural US, radio glorifying genocide... it is very disturbing.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 week ago

Which makes the blob anti-semitic for saying anti-zionism is anti-semitic.

[–] [email protected] -5 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (4 children)

If you had looked at the link of this post, you would have read:

Twitch specifies this is conditional: you’re allowed to discuss the political movement of that name, but not “attack or demean another individual or group of people on the basis of their background or religious belief.”

I.e. nothing is masqueraded here as long as they keep to this. This seems to be a reasonable policy. I've seen a couple of instances of people being derogatorily called zionists just for supporting the people of current Israel not being pushed away out of their now decades-old homes, which is hard to still call Zionist if they don't support any further expansion and any offensive military action.

There's almost never anything gained to use "Zionist" on someone as if saying "asshole".

[–] [email protected] 17 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Twitch specifies this is conditional: you’re allowed to discuss the political movement of that name, but not “attack or demean another individual or group of people on the basis of their background or religious belief.”

Zionist is a political term, it has nothing to do with one’s background or religious belief.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 week ago (1 children)

You're entirely right.

But see if the political view is only held by members or a certain religious group (even if not all members of said religion accept said political thought), it's easy to conflate it, so that you can ban anyone opposing said political thought based on "they're discriminating against me because of my religion".

Fuck twitch.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Except not all Zionists are Jews, many are Christian.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 week ago

Well, I guess, but... you could argue that Zionists are mostly seen to be purely Jewish due to the nature of the movement.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 week ago (1 children)

which is hard to still call Zionist if they don't support any further expansion and any offensive military action.

Your 'if' is doing a lot of heavy lifting. And is fucking hilarious given they keep expanding and pushing people out of their decades old homes.

Funny how that part seems to be ignored in defense of zionists....

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 week ago

say what you say about state of Israel but they got AIPAC to run propaganda of the history!

being able to mobilize foreign population to support your genocide really is the psyop of all times lol

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 week ago

I guess my pessimistic lens is a little strong and I generally don't trust large companies to act in good faith. So maybe I'm over scrutinizing here and being a bit of a curmudgeon.

I think your perspective is fair, and it's likely this is akin to a high school faculty dealing with some random word or idea becoming a meme of sorts and causing problems. So they have to write some new rule that sounds ridiculous or weird.

It sucks there's so much racism and bigotry driving forces in the world that it's hard to not be dubious of everything. You always kinda wonder about the actual motivation behind things like this.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Zionists identify themselves as zionists. How's that a slur?

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 week ago (1 children)

I identify myself as a homosexual.

I've heard homo being used in a derogatory way as an insult. That usage should not be tolerated.

Retarded is just a medical term, yet you can use it as an insult as well.

That is what this "specification of conditional" aims at. It's fine to use the word in a descriptive way, you're just not allowed to go around angrily calling people "fucking zionist"

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 week ago

They use the word starting with F not the word homosexual