Risa

It’s 24XX, who the hell is still getting bent out of shape about homosexuality 400 years from now?

I'm pretty lukewarm on Discovery, I've seen all of it but most episodes only once, so maybe I just don't remember it. Who got bent out of shape over Stamets and/or Culber being gay?

Topa was normalised, it was the reactions against her that were treated as the outlier. Beautiful work.

Expanse did it well too. There is a character that uses different pronouns, and people just used the right pronouns for them. Thats it. Boom representation achieved.

Now I get that trills were used to stealthily start trying to get trans and gender queer screentime in a very hostile 90s era.

In discovery, Adiras coming out had to once again be aided with the framing of the trill.

Adira had to loudly declare their preferred pronouns in the deep future when all of this was supposed to be no big deal.

It would have been so intelligent if they were just called by their pronouns and were just treated like any other character.

I understood the writers managed to get a coming out story that a lot of people can relate to. But in the future people should just be, and not need to come out.

Again, it’s 24XX, I’m supposed to believe humanity has achieved near-utopia, why am I getting the feeling that you’re trying to show me how gay these dudes are purely because they’re gay.

What? When did DIS ever do that? The fact Stamets and Culber are gay is not central to their character or any episodes. They're just normal people who do normal things who is accepted by everyone around them without question. I'm not sure how much normal you can get than that. I think your issue is that they exist because DIS doesn't do anything you claim with Stamets and Culber.

The Orville, on the other hand, just kinda… treated it like it was normal.

No, it doesn't at all. Topa has zero character development beyond being transgender. The Orville only brings her out when they want to make an episode about her being discriminated against. She has zero character development outside that. That isn't normal.

How does that not go against my previous complaints? Well, Topa isn’t human.

It does contradict your other complaint. Your praising the show that does exactly what you said you don't want, and complaining about the show that does exactly what you supposedly want to see. Relegating LGBTQ issues to alien allegories is erasure.

A human utopia involves everyone being treated equally,

Which DIS does. Stamets and Culber are treated normally.

so when you imply different treatment, whether through dialog choices or cinematography

DIS doesn't do this. There's no hidden subtext which suggests they're different. Not once are they ever discriminated against, even by the evil empress from the racist universe. I'm literally baffled how you think otherwise. I think your own phobias are making you see something that isn't there.

A big part of science fiction is how fictional technology and environments of the future that would seem very strange to us are completely normal to them. I agree that this should also extend to society itself and its speculative future progress. In the same sense that a character wouldn't find a replicator to be strange technology it wouldn't make sense to treat someones sexual orientation or gender to be strange if it is a social issue that was supposedly a thing of the distant past. I find that a lot of 21st century social issues seem to find their way into modern Star Trek in ways that don't make a lot of sense.

They also don't really force their will onto the Moclans. Sure, everyone else fundamentally disagrees with them, but they still respect Moclan sovereignty. The Orville's federation is content to let them live as they choose. Instead of demanding compliance they agree to disagree. The crew focuses on guidance and assistance so they can help their Moclan allies figure it all out on their own terms.

Like, something that turned me off of nu-trek was how the representation was handled. It felt pandery to an almost gross extent.

you must be nu to star trek

Ah, glad it wasn't just me who thought 1 & 2 were better than 3. 😅

Really? Season three is where I really thought Seth toned down the dick and fart jokes and started focusing on what made ST amazing. The whole left behind story where Gordon is trapped for long enough in the past that he has a whole family he has to leave behind was heartbreaking and exactly the sort of storyline that made me love TNG in the first place.

The first few episodes were indeed rough, but by the end of season 1 it becomes the star trek youve been craving.