this post was submitted on 25 Nov 2024
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[–] [email protected] 2 points 18 minutes ago

How much did I like that one guy really.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 15 minutes ago

Well obviously you should pull the lever once the front wheels past the split but before the rear wheels cross it, so that trolley gets off the rails. This way everybody has the chance to survive and you have defensible position during inevitable court hearing.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 hour ago

Yell "Jump!"

[–] [email protected] 11 points 2 hours ago (3 children)

If you think about this for any length of time and actually imagine this scenario, you realise you don't pull the lever and it's not even close.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 29 minutes ago

Wrong. You pick the obviously wrong moral stance and then aggressively yell about it on the internet. The more obvious it becomes that you are wrong, the louder you yell. This protects your ego from introspection.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 58 minutes ago (1 children)

You realize this is your family watching you make the decision to have their vehicle run over a loved one? There's a possibility they all live if you pull it.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 42 minutes ago (1 children)

Or if you pull it, then they see you make the decision to risk their lives to kill three other people.

What is better, three lives lost or one life lost?

[–] [email protected] 3 points 34 minutes ago (1 children)

ok but what if the 3 in the middle were avg US swing state voters.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 31 minutes ago

The other side would deal with them then.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 hour ago

But then your loved one (mom, dad, sister,child) dies.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 3 hours ago (2 children)

Have these folks seen The Good Place? Or are they just approaching the same conclusion by accident?

[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 hours ago (2 children)

By far the smartest show ever written and it's not even close!

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 hour ago

Lmao what. Sure it covers philosophy 101, but not as smart as say, Dark, Mr Robot, Better Call Saul, Watchmen etc.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 hours ago

Idk .. Andor has a really good message.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 hours ago

For a second there, I really thought you meant

[–] [email protected] 6 points 2 hours ago

The meaning behind the trolly problem has been entirely eroded at this point.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

mercifully pulling both levers.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 hour ago (1 children)

But then how do you kill the remaining two people?

[–] [email protected] 4 points 57 minutes ago

Survivor's guilt

[–] [email protected] 11 points 4 hours ago* (last edited 4 hours ago) (2 children)

I think these scenarios might be easier to analyze if we made them a bit more realistic.

This an analogy for military intervention. If we empower our military to be proactive, we can save one "good guy"^TM^ by killing 3 bystanders. But if NATO's adversaries are participating too we lose 3 of our "good guy"^TM^

[–] OneWomanCreamTeam 7 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

I think the abstract nature is one of the strengths. If you ask someone a question about military intervention, their pre-existing views towards military intervention will heavily bias their answer.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 hours ago

its also a good metaphor for climate change

[–] [email protected] 1 points 4 hours ago

Look at the actual Cuban Missile Crisis.

[–] [email protected] 48 points 9 hours ago (5 children)

for the longest time, i did know that game theory did not have anything to do with “games” and that it is somehow connected to the prisoners dilemma, but the concept as such wasn’t very clear to me. If you are like my former me, take 30 minutes out of your day and visit https://ncase.me/trust/ to learn and play around with game theory; it’s a great webpage and it’s pretty good fun all around.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 2 hours ago

I did a few game theory simulations in college and they were always real interesting. In one of them for example, it was a multiplayer game, with multiple interactions. I think it was to simulate global trade basically: you could cooperate with as many players as you want and each time you cooperate you both get a point. If you defect then you get two and they get none. However, all the players could see what the other players are doing, so if you defected they would know and probably would play (trade) with you. The best way to win was to form as many connections as possible and fully cooperate the whole time.

I formed maybe like 20-30 connections with other players and didn't defect. Each point was worth a few cents or something. So I walked out with a check for like $20-$50 or something. Many players walked out with nothing because they cheated too many people too many times and nobody wanted to trade with them.

Therefore, clearly, the best economic policy is protectionism, tariffs, trade wars, and fucking over both allies and enemies, right? Right?!?

[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 hours ago

For those interested, Veritasium has a very good video on this. It also sort of tells what strategy is optimal to "win".

[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 hours ago

Thank you for sharing the link. That webpage is amazing!

[–] [email protected] 8 points 5 hours ago

That page is very well done and interesting, thanks for sharing!

[–] [email protected] 16 points 10 hours ago (2 children)

Theoretically, will a collision cause a breach of the radioactive material that's in the box with my cat? Asking for a friend.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 2 hours ago

Yes and no.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 hours ago

If cat can witness the event, then Yes or No but not both.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 10 hours ago (1 children)

The outcome from both levers pulled is so steep that it really makes no sense to pull the lever

[–] [email protected] 26 points 10 hours ago (2 children)

That's why they won't pull the lever, and that's why you should.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 hours ago* (last edited 3 hours ago)

Not really. This would all happen so fast and be emotionally, not logically, driven.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 8 hours ago

They'll be thinking the same thing tho and if there is a greater than 20% chance of them pulling the lever it'd be worse in terms of losing family members than not pulling at all.

But in terms of overall death, not pulling the lever is 1 or 4, and pulling the lever is 4 or 13

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