this post was submitted on 08 Nov 2024
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Summary

Historians suggest Democrats might have fared better against Donald Trump by embracing the economic issues championed by Senator Bernie Sanders, who has long pushed for a focus on “bread-and-butter” concerns for working-class voters.

Despite Kamala Harris’s progressive policies, polls showed Trump was favored on economic issues, particularly among working-class and Hispanic voters.

Historian Leah Wright Rigueur argued that Sanders’ messaging on economic struggles could be key for future Democratic strategies.

Sanders himself criticized the party for “abandoning” the working class, which he said has led to a loss of support across racial lines.

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[–] [email protected] 183 points 1 week ago (26 children)

More voters should have listened to Bernie.

He told people what to do.

[–] [email protected] 26 points 1 week ago (3 children)

Yes, but people forgot that his real message was to get out there an be the change. Bernie's message was never about relying on or believing in the Democrats, it was that change only happens when we mobilize.

He told us to get out there and run ourselves and get personally involved and invested in our local politics so we can be the revolution.... We just chose not to listen to him.

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[–] [email protected] 147 points 1 week ago (14 children)

It is absolutely clear now. The DNC is a private company whose main function is to fund raise, period. If they also win an election then that's great, but if it comes to a choice between winning and raising money, they will choose raising money. They will never move to the left to win voters if it will cost them fund raising opportunities from the center and right.

[–] [email protected] 31 points 1 week ago (3 children)

This honestly makes so much more sense than anything else. I think you nailed it. Republicans are motivated by money and exerting social control so they write up manifestos (p2025), take over the courts, work hard to disenfranchise voters, lie, cheat, anything is on the table. The DNC does indeed seem fairly comfortable with losing by comparison, despite the fact that the leftist ideals they supposedly dabble in create a moral imperative to never lose. I wonder if Republicans fucking pay the DNC money to run these candidates we all know aren't the best. They're just good enough to get votes against mother fucking Trump. But not always good enough to win, barely good enough when they are, typically.

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[–] [email protected] 97 points 1 week ago (2 children)

I've been saying that since the DNC fucked him over in the 2016 election. I voted for Biden, then Harris, but I never fucking forgot who's to blame for the state of things now.

[–] [email protected] 19 points 1 week ago

I will never forget or forgive the DNC for 2016. I worked on his campaign. I went to the primary, in my state at the time a caucus, and felt the energy and excitement of everyone. He was the real deal. Unfortunately, he's a little too old now.

Other Dem campaigns often don't invite their voters to help out like Bernie or Stacey Abrams - instead they ask for money repeatedly. I got a million texts for money this year. It's giving "Election Christmas" in a capitalist way.

[–] [email protected] 77 points 1 week ago (8 children)

If we had run Bernie in 2016, Trump would still be nothing but a punchline.

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[–] [email protected] 76 points 1 week ago (5 children)

In hindsight it seems obvious, but to be honest I really thought Kamala would have fared better.

[–] [email protected] 40 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (2 children)

We all did, you're not wrong.

It's a sad reality we all woke up to on Wednesday. Learning that the majority of Americans are ignorant, racist, misogynistic, selfish assholes.

[–] wildbus8979 27 points 1 week ago (2 children)

We all did

No, we did not "all" think so, a lot of us have been saying this for quite a while. In fact since at least the 2016 election cycle started in 2015.

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[–] [email protected] 37 points 1 week ago (1 children)

This is what many said in 2016 after Clinton lost but we still did it again in 2020 and yet again in 2024. If I were a betting man I'd say that if there's sill an election worth having in 2028 we'll see another, even further right leaning, centrist Democrat win the nomination.

[–] the_post_of_tom_joad 20 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (3 children)

Yoyo look, this guy's fucking nostradamus up in here, right? It's gonna happen just like this.

I'm thinking newsome is the "perfect" candidate for 28.

Whoever it is, I bet you, just like me can't wait to be told how stupid i am and actually great they are by credulous online political minds who call parroting the pundits talking points word-for-word fucking theory

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[–] [email protected] 29 points 1 week ago (3 children)

To me the main takeaway is that I live in a completely separate reality from most voters. I would have voted on a dead dog over Trump. He is mean, narcissistic and never shows any empathy. On top of that he is clearly losing his wits. If a majority of voters prefers a candidate like this, is even enthusiastic to vote for him, what can you do?

I also know that Lemmy skews left, but I think we have to face the fact that most voters have no ability to empathise with those worse off. There is no left wing politics without empathy and solidarity. What most of us here want is dead.

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[–] [email protected] 71 points 1 week ago (9 children)

The screams of "Dems need to move right" (not from Bernie, obv) are fucking clown shoes and hilarious. She was running around with Liz and Dick Motherfucking Cheney. There's no more right to move to without literally just embracing Trump.

But here's the thing: libs keep cutting their noses off. Why would the actual left give the DNC the fucking time of day? They raise a billion fucking dollars, light it all on fire and go out to brunch. They co-opt movements like the Floyd uprising and metoo but leave everyone else to do the actual work. When we need bodies in the streets, when we need material support, when we fucking TELL THEM WHAT POLICIES WILL WORK FOR US, they spout some 1950s realpolitik bullshit and have some more wine.

Biden: you're immune. Have some fun with it. Show us you have skin I the game. $100 says he keeps up this "when they go low we go high" bullshit and does somewhere between nothing and the bare minimum.

[–] [email protected] 41 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Biden: you’re immune. Have some fun with it. Show us you have skin I the game

You may not remember, but it's only been a few months since Biden said he "wouldn't really care if trump won as long as he tried his best".

He literally doesn't have any skin in the game, the party leaders don't really give a fuck.

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[–] [email protected] 25 points 1 week ago (2 children)

They raise a billion fucking dollars, light it all on fire and go out to brunch.

This is the most infuriating part, and it made me happy I kept replying STOP to all their fucking "ZOMG 10X MATCHING" texts. They blew all that money and their political consultant cronies made out like bandits. They outraised and outspent Trump and have fuck all to show for it.

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[–] khornechips 63 points 1 week ago (1 children)

That’s great analysis except for one detail… what progressive policies?! Like ceding the “border issue” to the republicans? Like backpedaling on fracking when they needed votes from PA? I voted for her because she was the only option but in no universe was her campaign progressive.

[–] [email protected] 37 points 1 week ago (1 children)

I think they mean that her running mate did some progressive stuff as governor. Or maybe we're just so far right now that referring to LGBT as if they're human beings counts as being progressive

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[–] [email protected] 59 points 1 week ago

Thats what they get for squeezing Bernie out and giving the people garbage candidates. Eat it, you fools.

[–] [email protected] 56 points 1 week ago (21 children)

I don't really know how the Democratic Party is expected to steer out of the center-right ditch, though. With all the dark money calling the shots, I mean. Bernie is the exception that proves the rule.

The electorate is actually far more progressive on the issues than the corporate media lets on. But the minute the Democratic Party were to embrace Bernie-style positions? You can bet that not only the "liberal media" would declare this sO vErY eXtReMe, but all the big money would be spending against them, and spending against them hard. Think it's bad now where crypto, Elon, and the Washington Post are tilting against the Democrats? Imagine they actually embraced progressives....

Not saying I love it, I just don't know what the answer is.

[–] [email protected] 38 points 1 week ago (3 children)

At this point maybe the democrats just need to embrace these hard positions and normalize them. The gop doesn't appear to care how radical their stances are and they get votes regardless of the racism. Trump's whole shtick has been normalizing bad behavior and gaslighting the other party into thinking any wrong they do is a gotcha- they're operating on two very different rulesets.

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[–] Grandwolf319 40 points 1 week ago (2 children)

You guys need to think of the DNC as more of a for profit business.

From that perspective, they were super successful in making so much money.

Remember, there can be more money made when you intentionally lose, similar to butch in pulp fiction.

[–] Bakkoda 21 points 1 week ago (3 children)

Every single text i got had donate in the first sentence. The DNC had a very singular message this cycle and it was donate. It shows the flaws in the system and it shows the flaws in the party. Until i start seeing serious conversations about serious fuckin issues like repealing Citizens United, universal healthcare and proper privacy laws I can no longer consider the DNC a serious organization.

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[–] [email protected] 38 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Bernie is a leftist politician. The Democrat party is not a liberal leftist party, they're a conservative corporatist party.

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[–] [email protected] 35 points 1 week ago

His message hasn't changed. They don't only not listen, but actively oppose his message.

[–] [email protected] 33 points 1 week ago (22 children)

Despite Kamala Harris’s progressive policies...

Wait, I am not trying to be (overly) mean here but what where they? I just remember her running on a status quo platform.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 1 week ago (14 children)

If she was running on a progressive platform I never heard about it

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[–] [email protected] 33 points 1 week ago (2 children)

If democrats were capable of listening we wouldnt have two terms of donald trump.

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[–] [email protected] 32 points 1 week ago
[–] [email protected] 32 points 1 week ago (1 children)

TIL I'm a fucking historian, apparantly

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[–] [email protected] 32 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (4 children)

Dems imbraced the race to the bottom instead of being a true opposition party. I voted for them this time around but never again unless they make a platform surrounding core left prencipals and left leadership. Many within my communities gave up on political means to help their communities and threw themselves into volunteering, activism, and self sustainability. You can't demand bottomless support and obedience from your base while ignoring their cries for help.

Dems said they are the party of science and facts but wouldn't support universal health care or simply stop sending weapons to Isreal. If they were just as ravenous as republican are, can you honestly say we couldn't achieve those good things?

Dems said the Supreme court and justice system was courupt, but never even investigated the court or made cuts to the militarization of the police forces. Police are still killing people at the same rates with no real accountability. If the Supreme Court was left leaning Republicans would have expanded the court to make it right leaning.

Just do what Republicans do to get there way but for good. I honestly can't think of one dem policy that has been as impactful as some of the top Republican changes in the past 50 years.

Ultimately we need to come together and demand better because if the dems don't change it'll be 50 more years of being steamrolled.

[–] [email protected] 19 points 1 week ago (3 children)

Honestly, your democratic party is very right wing to most of European. And you saying people give up on politics and turn to sctivism is so sad.

If the government doesn't take care of his poor, minorities, what are they doing.

[–] [email protected] 20 points 1 week ago

If the government doesn't take care of his poor, minorities, what are they doing.

Facilitating the transfer of wealth to the richest fraction of the population.

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[–] [email protected] 30 points 1 week ago (5 children)

We tried. Biden's Build Back Better bill had a lot of pro-working class stuff in it. We just couldn't pass it with Manchin and Sinema resisting.

Details are important.

[–] [email protected] 42 points 1 week ago (2 children)

This is about messaging, not policy. Most people don't really pay attention to actual policy, so it's more about convincing your average Joe you're working for them. Bernie had that, Biden and Harris didn't.

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[–] [email protected] 30 points 1 week ago (16 children)

I think the inherent problem with the build back better deal is it's still framed within the neoliberal trickle down economics of post Regan America.

Would it have increased some workers protections and child care, sure. But it would ultimately be a gift to the shareholders and owners of corporations able to tap into the 3 trillion dollars of funding.

Americans are tired of progressive bills that vicariously improve their lives by further bribing the economic class that actually have their boots on our necks.

People are tired of seeing headlines that the American economy is doing fine while they struggle to put food on the table. Nobody cares if your bosses retirement portfolio is breaking records when they have to pull overtime to maintain the same quality of life they had 20 years ago.

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[–] [email protected] 23 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (2 children)

I usually vote along with the democrats, but neoliberals are so freaking elitist and clueless. As much as it pisses me off that I'm going to have to deal with whatever fascist bs Trump has in store, it's really quite nice seeing them get their asses handed to them by a populist... It's just too bad it wasn't a left-wing populist.

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[–] [email protected] 20 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (3 children)

It seems to me that a lot of people are confused about what "supporting the working class" would actually mean.

It wouldn't mean that the working class would start thinking like Democrats. It will mean that Democrats will start thinking like the working class. Think about the implications, they're not all what you want them to be.

Probably worth it, though.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 1 week ago (4 children)

The implications, like supporting a higher minimum wage, universal healthcare, labor protections, unionization, and ending the forever wars?

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[–] [email protected] 19 points 1 week ago

Shame the Democrats just told Bernie he is wrong. Again.

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