this post was submitted on 14 May 2024

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Funny, those guys don't usually agree on that much (lemm.ee)

submitted 5 months ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

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Do any of them know what the word "liberal" actually means?

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[–] [email protected] 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Far be it from me to point out you're doing exactly the kind of disingenuous re-framing you're accusing others of by excluding those to the left of you as fringe. Yes, American liberals are 'left-leaning' compared to conservatives (on exactly the same arbitrary binary scale that is being critiqued by the comparison), but they still share core elements of classical liberalism, particularly by the emphasis on protecting liberal institutions like private property and market-based mechanisms. This isn't about muddying the waters—it's about acknowledging the nuance in political ideologies. There's real divide between those who support these liberal institutions and those who aim to dismantle them. It doesn't matter if you think that perspective is fringe - the distinction being made is still there. We're pointing to a genuine ideological distinction, not just retreating to safer rhetorical grounds.

People making the liberal comparison aren't trying to place you on a political binary, they're trying to point to a distinction that you're actively trying to erase or dismiss.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

They're pointing to a distinction that no one cares about (except the fringe - yes, fringe - Leftists who want to abolish private property) and using that as a platform to imply or outright say false things about American liberals.

Very similar to the above example.

Motte: I, a Leftist, am criticizing the liberal support of private property, that's all

Bailey: liberals also support fascism/colonialism/laissez-faire capitalism/insert Republican ideology here therefore Democrats support fascism/colonialism/laissez-faire capitalism/insert Republican ideology here

[–] [email protected] 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Jesus, I can't keep having this argument with you. I will accept "Leftists who want to abolish private property [are fringe]" as an acceptance of the assertion that American Liberals share all or most of the central ideological tenants of Classical Liberalism.

liberals also support fascism/colonialism/laissez-faire capitalism/insert Republican ideology here therefore Democrats support fascism/colonialism/laissez-faire capitalism/insert Republican ideology here

LMAO, nobody is saying american liberals support any of those things on the basis of their liberal ideology. I'm not even sure you understand what a motte-and-bailey is, those two arguments don't follow.