Unpopular Opinion

Your opinion OK, but what makes it really unpopular, even like lukewarm-shit-unpopular, is the fact that it is some very poorly substantiated criticism.

Proton works great for me. Windows also has problems with selecting the audio source. I only have one monitor so I can't tell for the others.

I find it very unfair that people will forgive any shortcoming of windows but Linux should be absolutely perfect or it's not usable. No one can make a printer work on windows better than on anything, and projecting a presentation is always going to fail 50% of the time. When it fails on windows, it's a stuff problem, but when it's on Linux it's a Linux problem somehow...

I've been using Linux since 2004, in various distros, exclusively as my desktop for any computer I own or control.

I nonetheless agree with you 100%.

Linux¹ is an OS that appeals to a very narrow spectrum of a very narrow subculture of people. As a desktop OS for the general public it is basically a disaster area. If video doesn't fuck you up, audio will, or Bluetooth, or networking, or any number of other sharp corners and rusty nails sticking out. You either get used to fixing these (and then never touching them ever again once solved ... and hope the next kernel update doesn't fuck you over!) or you get the joy of sifting through a myriad of subtly incorrect and/or out of date "help" articles online. (Documentation?! Don't make me laugh. You wouldn't like me when I laugh.)

There are a few reasons for this. Of these, one is out of the control of the Linux community. The rest are the Linux community's to fix, however. But they won't. (The reason for this is one of the items listed.)

• Manufacturers of hardware won't release the information needed to write drivers for their products, and won't commit to writing and maintaining good drivers of their own.
• The kernel has its ABI changed more often than, I suspect, an average kernel maintainer changes their underwear. (This contributes to why manufacturer drivers tend to drift into shit.)
• The development community is almost pathologically opposed to writing proper documentation. (Hint: reference documentation is not sufficient and never has been.)
• People who do write documentation (often third parties), are not supported in any way by those who don't: changes aren't checked against existing documentation and the latter updated, for example.
• There's a strong "it was hard for me to learn; it should be hard for everyone to learn!" vibe in the user community.
• There's also a strong element of denial in said user community: a lot of "works for me, so it must be your problem". The problem being with Linux is not considered seriously and, indeed, is strongly denied when mentioned as a possibility.
• Fixing complicated (albeit often entirely unnecessary) problems is literally addictive. A lot of users are addicted specifically to the dopamine hit of solving a complicated, if pointless, problem and thus don't see this as a problem. They expect other users to be similarly addicted.
• A lot of users view the computer's OS as the end, not the means to an end. This clashes with the viewpoint of users who just want their OS to get the fuck out of their way so they can work on their actual ends.

So why do I still use Linux, given all my negativity above?

• I do a lot of work with programming languages that most people haven't even seen used in anger. Many of these aren't supported under Windows in the first place; those which are tend not to be very well supported. Unix-like systems are the most common supported systems in that space.
• I really, really, really hate all the spying that gets done by commercial software and would rather deal with the problems that crop up using Linux than feeding a bunch of sociopathic billionaires even more data.
• This is probably the big one: I don't play computer games. I hate the fucking things enough without wanting them in my entertainment. Many of the problems that people have vanish into nothingness if you're not a gamer.
• I am a gigantic nerd. (In all senses of "gigantic" here.)

¹ Before some Yahoo tries to "own" me by pointing out "BUT ANDROID IS BASED ON THE LINUX KERNEL TOO!!!!111oneoneoneeleventy!", here I'm using "Linux" as a shortcut for "Linux on desktop systems as a desktop OS. That Android thing is not the killer line you think it is. It just makes you look intellectually dishonest.

People in this thread have noted that some systems seem to be Linux-cursed, and I've definitely experienced that. Usually it's a specific piece of hardware that isn't well supported, or a package or default configuration that has an issue. I've had systems that were spinning their heads and spraying pea soup everywhere on OpenSUSE and Debian turn around and behave perfectly on Gentoo (that was 17 years ago, but it doesn't seem to be a unique experience).

Regarding the controller, if you're connecting a PS4 controller via bluetooth I think I had the same problem earlier today, and there's an issue open on the bluez github about it. I found a post on the Arch bbs with a workaround. TLDR, bluez has had a few issues in the latest builds and reverting all your bluez libraries to 5.68-1 seems to solve it for most people, including me. Unfortunately, this kind of thing crops up occasionally. Everywhere really, but especially on Linux because of how much it relies on community contributions to projects.

Anyway, I've rambled too long. Sounds like you got bit by either a driver issue or a config/package issue. Sorry it happened to you, and sorry it soured you on Linux. If you're looking for something that "just works" and aren't getting it with Linux, no reason to beat your head against a wall.

How can you flame like this without mentioning the distribution so we can shit on it!

I’m a software developer with about twenty years in the field, spending my first half of that working in a Unix environment. I have tried so hard to make Linux my home desktop solution. I’ve come back to it every five years or so, hoping it’s finally figured out the UI/UX thing.

Things I like:

• no comercial motivation
• intrinsically programmer-oriented
• free with available sources, as deep as I care to dig

Things I don’t like:

• High barrier to entry (which distro?)
• Poor support for newer hardware (not a fault of Linux but a reality)
• Too much competition in very basic facilities like package managers and desktop environments
• Well-intentioned but largely unhelpful community support due to the above points

I’m back using Linux again (Fedora) because at the moment I’m doing a lot of embedded and SoC work, and again I love the dev experience. But so far it seems like not much has changed wrt how fiddly daily driving can be. I can’t stand W11 for a lot of reasons, but I’m constantly tempted to try my luck with WSL as a better compromise.

user server does not check out

Linux is my main driver for work, so I don't have the same challenges as you do for gaming or graphics, but am interested in which distro you're using?

There are warts definitely, but haven't had the issues you point out with monitors or audio using Debian or Fedora. That said it still is a lot like Lego when it comes to desktop use - dozens of ways to build something and it can vary a heap in the different ways you approach it.

Agreed it is still a ways off mainstream with the exception of power users or very streamlined environments like the Steamdeck.

What distro were you using? I've literally never had any problems with controllers, video cards, monitors, or anything that you've mentioned. Also, Proton not working is extremely rare. Basically the only thing that prevents games from running perfectly for me is anti-cheat specifically not being supported by the game studio.

I've basically always used Ubuntu which is very stable and the most Windows-like experience imo. Maybe you should give Ubuntu a try if you haven't?

I won't downvote you for having an unpopular opinion. But I'll definitely downvote you for putting passive aggressive shit like "can't speak bad about linux on lemmy now can we" in your post title. Lemmy isn't a monolith and your experiences with downvote brigading and dogpiling isn't universal.

Yep, Linux is certainly not perfect, and it's not for everyone, though it's improving all the time. A lot of the problems you were seeing come down to distro and Desktop environment, paired with hardware.

Because of the amount of choice and preferences we have, not all the desktop environments are feature parity, and each team has their own priorities. It's just a shame that you practically have to do homework in order to have the best experience, when Linux users themselves say that the biggest benefit is choice.

It does have quite a bit of problems, bugs and fails at the basics more often than not.

I kinda feel like I'm being gaslit whenever I bring it up and people say it "just works".

Because. Well. It doesn't.

Sorry but if you can't get Gold or even Platinum rated games to run then the problem is in front of the monitor.

I put Linux Mint on my laptop about ten years ago. Finally, this year, my track pad started working.

I'm not going to downvote, but I doubt yours is actually an unpopular opinion. It's just that the minority linux diehards are very vocal.

The rest of us tried it and moved on, because we have better things to do with our lives, ran into driver issues, and/or don't enjoy tinkering.

And why get into an argument with someone who's enjoying linux? They're enjoying it and happy with it. No need to shit on their parade.

I don't think you are being fair. There are a ton of issues that people experience with Windows but everyone just accepts it because Windows is seen as "Normal".

Any issue you experience in Linux is magnified by it being a different issue than the ones you are used to in Windows and your unfamiliarity with Linux.

One of the cool things about Linux is you actually have a hope of being able to fix issues yourself without waiting for a company to solve your problems.

I don't try to run Windows applications on Linux, but I imagine that could be frustrating. But that is a bit like being angry at your dog for not being a cat. You can buy your dog a cat costume but it's still just a good boy trying his best to do what you want.

I'm sorry to hear you had a bad experience with Linux.

One of the problems with that family of systems is hardware compatibility. Unfortunately if your hardware is not (proven) to be compatible with Linux, you will have problems. Sometimes those problems are of the "my system won't start" kind. Often, these will be hard to identify and fix.

Linux is not yet IMO a system for general use. Fixing problems can be long, tedious and require you to read a lot of docs. Yesterday I spent a few hours fixing my package manager, which was recently broken by a system update. Yay.

I have been using dual boots for years for that very same reason. I am a software developer and Linux makes a lot of sense for my work. But for videogames (and other software not supported on Linux), Windows is my platform of choice.

The question I would ask myself if I was you is: do you need Linux? If so, I would next check (before anything else) hardware compatibility with some distro that makes sense for you (one that comes shipped with good graphics drivers for example). There are a few distro that work reasonably well for some of those cases. If you don't need Linux (and you don't like tinkering with systems) then I would suggest reconsidering your choice of platform.

Anyway, I wish you all the best settling for a system that works for you and hopefully you can see a quick end to your frustrations.

Edit: typo

Honestly youre right. When i first started using linux it was for fun, something different. It had so many issues that by default id boot into windows and use ubuntu occassionally to learn it some more. A few years later and endeavour is my daily driver and im lucky enough to have 0 issues whatsoever, i love it but its probably dumb luck that all my hardware works well. The issues people have with linux seem totally random, some people breeze through it, then theres people like you that just encounter so much seemingly random bs.

Youre right about the circlejerks, enjoy the comments that are gonna come pouring in lol

I haven’t tried gaming on linux, but I completely agree on the audio part. I have a laptop running PopOS, had a meeting and it just won’t change from the built-in mic, and some mic’s won’t even get recognized. Let’s just say meetings are now like my gaming, windows only.

I've only had issues like this on a particular laptop. Luckily it was a work laptop so not a big deal but this thing hated Linux. It would have issues on almost every front like the audio device suddenly not working or it isn't able to change brightness or not being able to turn on because a mouse is plugged in. Weird shit like that. Sometimes it would lock up for no reason.

I've installed Linux on my personal laptop and only had a few minor issues. Any issue on my PC I try to fix because I use it so often but Wayland has automated a lot of the more annoying parts like having to stream audio through my mic on Discord.

It definitely has issues that can be frustrating. I was dealing with applications not hooking up to my audio properly but it turned out that pipewire needed a restart then it was good to go. I'm currently waiting for LCARSWM to be updated so I can test it out. My Bluetooth keyboard hasn't been interacting well but this might be fixed but I'll need to test it.

I love to tinker and problem solving is my bread and butter so Linux is ideal for me. I hated how much Windows kept obscuring things I needed to see just to play around with settings. It's almost accepted that some shit will require getting into the weeds with because Linux is so overlooked by companies that something somewhere will break. I'm fine with it because I enjoy the challenge and I hate the sacrifices I'd have to make to use Windows.

You're not alone, but it's an unpopular opinion among geeks. I guess most of them are just bored and therefore love to tinker with these kind of issues. I value my time and prefer not to care about my OS doing things for me. I like to have the option to do so, if I need, but I shouldn't have too. Windows allows that, MacOS doesn't and Linux allows too much of that, even requires it.

Another part is the dopamine rush when an issue got solved. Obviously you don't get any if it works right away.

My windows 10 is running flawless since 2019 and it didn't slow down or get bloated. I have disabled a few options but that's about it. Meanwhile my coworker is fighting bad drivers every day. Not even talking about games that simply don't work at all.

I use Linux at work and it's great when you set up a VM to do one thing and then forget about it.

I've only had issues like this on a particular laptop. Luckily it was a work laptop so not a big deal but this thing hated Linux. It would have issues on almost every front like the audio device suddenly not working or it isn't able to change brightness or not being able to turn on because a mouse is plugged in. Weird shit like that. Sometimes it would lock up for no reason.

I've installed Linux on my personal laptop and only had a few minor issues. Any issue on my PC I try to fix because I use it so often but Wayland has automated a lot of the more annoying parts like having to stream audio through my mic on Discord.

It definitely has issues that can be frustrating. I was dealing with applications not hooking up to my audio properly but it turned out that pipewire needed a restart then it was good to go. I'm currently waiting for LCARSWM to be updated so I can test it out.