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In the GPU market AMD is both lazy and stupid: they just try to undercut NVIDIA a bit, they should understand that they don't have a product as good as RTX and focus to provide decent low price GPUs with a lot of RAM in the 200-400$ range.
If someone has 500 to spend they could as well spend 650 and buy NVIDIA, those on a budget on the other hand would buy AMD if they had proposed a 12-16gb good rastering option on the cheap.
Yea why not try to bring the same investment to the market where that company with 10x the market cap and only focuses on GPUs and AI chips can just lower pricing to stay competitive.not like AMD has console,handheld, consumer or Server chips to put RnD budget alongside radeon?
Also people would buy overpay to nvidia is what makes nvidia jack up to insanity that works towards amd undercutting.and also why gpu prices will increase all the time if behaviour is kept.look at 7800xt.it triple destroyed nvidias mid lineup to adjust prices pre and after launch.buying for the undercutter makes both companies to be more competitive at pricing. Which happened at that case.
AMD make the best CPU's at the moment.
amdip
I want to know the reason why AMD is hesitant to go to laptop/ prebuilt game. Prebuilts maybe not because of brand recognition leanient towards nvidia.(some sellers admit it very clearly) but in APU's and iGPUs amd should pay off more laptop brands to host their igpus.their 6700m is very price competitive where I live. Like its 2060 pricing... But much better. But you jsut cant find anything on stock or catalogue.I dont know how much nvidia bankrolls partners to stay loyal and pump laptops. But AMD maybe at least try to overcut. You gain Soooooo much market share from laptop sales its insane
AMD doesn't have enough production to make a dent on laptops, and they won't sacrifice anything else to improve it
I wish they got into a detachable laptop form factor. It’s why I’m excited for the upcoming Minisforum tablet/laptop. Touch experience on Gnome is pretty good and Gnome and KDE have touch centric environments in development that I haven’t tried
I can't imagine anyone in right mind buying Intel now, or maybe people buy them because they were always on Intel and are afraid of change. I've been loyal to Intel for ~20 years (with one AMD bought that was 386), but now their efficiency and progress is so poor that this brand is over for me.
I slept on Socket A and swore never to make that mistake again. I'm on my fourth Ryzen.
Hurray and congrats to AMD I guess? /s
Ryzen is one of the world's strongest tech brands now. Equal to RTX in some ways superior in others
Ryzen division's issues has to do with the gigantic inventory pileup that started in mid-2022 and forced them to undership the market for almost a year. It's bound to make shipment data reported by these research firms look funky.
That's an interesting way to say they have 15% market share, down from 30% a year ago...
AMD has been gradually increasing its Server CPU market share since 2017, but 2022 and 2023 turned out to be breakthrough years for the company as its share gains accelerated rapidly in recent quarters. AMD commanded a 23.3% unit share in Q3 2023, up from 18.6% quarter-over-quarter and 17.5% year-over-year. The revenue share has increased significantly by 4.7% QoQ and 5.8% YoY. Such major increases may be attributed to the high popularity of AMD's latest 4th Generation EPYC processors, which were the most popular data center products from AMD in Q3 as major cloud providers adopted them for internal workloads and public instances.
AMD is doing well with CPUs these days. GPUs on the other hand... they just aren't making the same progress there.
Do they need to compete with the 0.1% of GPUs or just compete with the 4080?
I think AMD is playing the long game on RT and they’re already kings at rasterization. A 4090 class card may not be needed anymore if their research pans out. They have some proofs of concept that would make the 4090 unnecessary.
I say this as a 4090 user. All the 4090 is for is brute forcing performance when software refinements are what’s really needed at this point. Then build hw accelerators once we have the software side sorted.
Hell even Nvidia is waffling at another 90 series card next gen.
Don’t think there’s the same level of focus there. Even when it comes to AI, AMD is pushing hard with ROCm. Recently progress on that has rapidly accelerated. They’re getting deals for their upcoming data center products. In comparison, how much revenue can be expected to be made with gaming? Especially since to make a gaming GPU they sacrifice being able to make a more profitable CPU or HPC/AI Accelerator. Furthermore when you look at the size difference between AMD and Nvidia (Nvidia’s profits are greater than AMD’s entire revenue) you see why the current situation has occurred. There’s no way AMD can keep pace with Nvidia given their smaller, divided resources. Not an excuse, just the reality.
Radeon really needs their Ryzen moment
Radeon needs massive investments in drivers and technology.
They had the raw compute power since a while but struggled to get this power 'onto the street'.
Something which is still baffling me, considering that they seem to do well on consoles.
Radeon needs massive investments in drivers and technology.
They had the raw compute power since a while but struggled to get this power 'onto the street'.
Something which is still baffling me, considering that they seem to do well on consoles.
It's not just about drivers tho. AMD driven consoles are also weak with good upscaling and ray tracing. It's getting to be a real problem on consoles because the resolution has to be dropped significantly when high quality ray tracing is used. Then those consoles have to upscale back to 4K with FSR2 which is still pretty bad.
Never going to happen because Nvidia always brings something subjective in the mix. and it always changes.
“It’s not enough that I should succeed all others must fail”
THAT is the true essence of the ryzen moment, it wasn’t just AMD making a strong move with Ryzen, it was also Intel falling flat on their face 10nm turmoil halted both process and architecture progress for several years.
not gonna happen until they fix their drivers
It's not a Ryzen "Moment." It was Ryzen momentum. They kept on improving gen after gen until they changed the consumer perspective of their brand.
While Radeon release one good gen, then they fumble the next two gens. And then blame Nvidia's mindshare.
AMD together with NVIDIA and Microsoft plans for new ARM CPU. Meanwhile Intel executives surrounded by their burning CPUs "its all fine..."
What are you basing that on?
The 7800XT in particular seems to be doing very well. At least in EU+US.
Yet for the price.. even as an RTX owner.. my next GPU will definitely be an AMD. I think AMD is in a good spot when it comes to price to performance right now. It's really hard to lead both CPU and GPU at the same time and nobody else is really even trying.
AMD is doing well with CPUs these days. GPUs on the other hand... they just aren't making the same progress there.
Not enough money. That's just what it is. Isn't a technology problem necessarily.
I don't really understand this sentiment, I have an RNDA 3 card and aside from the high idle power it's rock solid. Yes they don't have DLSS and RT performance of Nvidia, but in terms of raw performance it's excellent. Just because something is second best doesn't mean it's shit. People who complain about problems with cards are the slim minority of buyers. I think that's true of most products (I've heard nothing but horror stories about recent logitech mice, but I have one that's 5 years old now with no double click issues).
That's because you have to add the consoles lol. That's like 95% of their GPU revenue and probably the only reason why their GPU business have survived to this day.
The crazy thing is that's not even really true. RDNA2 competed extremely well with Ampere. In Raster it was generally slightly better than its direct competition, and excluding the insanity of Covid and supply shortages, it was always cheaper as well.
I paid $360 for my 6700xt in Dec 2022. Now 6700xt's are routinely like $300 on sale. The equivalent from Nvidia is... what? The 4060ti is slightly faster but only has 8gb of VRAM, and launched at $400 fucking dollars. The 4060ti 16gb is the same performance with more VRAM and launched at $500 fucking dollars.
At this point what's propping up Nvidia is unfathomable levels of mind share. The product stack doesn't actually deserve to sell anywhere near as well as it is currently.
It's certainly not unheard of in the tech world for this to happen. Look at Apple releasing a fucking $1600 MBP with 8gb of RAM, and then trying to gaslight their customers into believing it's better than it is, like they aren't being ripped off. Shit's absurd, but the average consumer is a pre-programmed midwit that relies almost entirely on brand loyalty to make their purchasing decisions.
And while I'm not super impressed with RDNA3 at launch, it's significantly better as the prices slowly creep down. I kind of figure the 7800xt will slowly creep down towards $450 being a normal price, and the 7700xt will probably creep under $400.
The 7600, when priced below 250, especially in the low 200's, like $220-230, is fantastic value as well.
Even at the high end, the 7900xt at $700-750 is a solid buy, and the 7900xt at $900 or less is very good as well.
Lovelace is fantastic from a technical perspective, but Nvidia outdid their own previous records for greed when it comes to the product stack and the pricing.
80% market share says it absolutely is true. the pricing power is evident from all the things you listed. Radeon has not been able to keep pace with the advancements to computer graphics coming out of NVIDIA.
huh? they still have the best $/performance cards, its only the absolute high-end they lose out to nvidia, and thats only for people who wont bat an eye dropping 1.5k on a gpu. that's why MS put them in the new xbox's, best bang for buck.
Not always true
They doing well in a server GPU space tho. Look up top-3 supercomputers, you probably will be surprised.
because theyre measured with fp64 perf. not exactly a useful operation for deep learning.
Meanwhile almost non-existent when it comes to GPUs in laptops.
To be fair, it's not a particularly large market, and i'd wager they'd have to put up a higher-than-worth-it cost to gain marketshare from Nvidia. They're contempt with their APU's for the time being.
Even on the Desktop they are under 15%
Not surprised at all, NVIDIA is still dominant in gaming laptops.
As someone who owned a laptop with an RX 6500M, I wish I got an RTX 3050 one instead. But that doesn't matter, I'm more of a desktop guy anyway.
If they can get APUs to the level of a RX 6600, they should be able to grow their laptop segment easily.
They already have great APUs with awesome efficiency relative to Intel. It just seems like they don't get nearly enough attention in the higher end laptop space. I'd love to go Ryzen for my next work laptop but there's virtually nothing.
Framework?
There are some really good sales on the 7000 series in the us.
7000 series had a rocky start, but the non-x chips and x3d chips are pretty good.
Upcoming Arm chips and Intel finally using EUV for Intel 4 will be fascinating to see.
Absurd motherboard prices were the main reason for Zen 4 desktop CPUs' mediocre launch impressions.
CPU value was bad too. AMD had to immediately cut prices after the 13th gen launch since Intel was offering better performance for the same price or cheaper, or equal performance for cheaper.
Server side from almost non-existence to close to 25% in about 5 years is actually very impressive, given the specific market tends to be rather conservative and has a lot of inertia to steer for your favor.
The server market is the fattest segment, Intel needs to get its $hit together, this is very alarming.
And considering AMD has roughly double the number of cores per CPU as Intel, AMD probably has a much higher share of CPU cores and of revenue than the 20-ish % market share in sockets sold.
Fat in what way?
This year intel has sold around $6-8B in client chips and $4B in server chips per quarter, give or take some hundreds of millions. At best years they were about equal at the time when intel was able to charge whatever they wanted for server chips. On AMD server chips now outsell client chips if you don't count gaming segment stuff ($1.6B vs $1.5B respectively last quarter), but that is mostly because of very anemic client sales.
When you look at the best offerings of the two companies, AMD is offering their 96 core 3d v cache EPYC at almost a third less price than Intel's 56 core sapphire rapids, and everything starts to make sense