I wonder how the cross messaging between apps will work. Especially when you think about encryption.
this post was submitted on 05 Sep 2023
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Why? Cross platform encryption is solved in a myriad of ways. Only thing missing is consensus and key verification. I think apps live Threema show how it can be done. Lacking a central instance to bless keys one could verify in person by scanning some code.
Well I’m mostly using Threema and that’s why I was curious about it.
I’ll be really happy to write to everyone from Threema as it’s a really good app but you don’t have so many people using it in my country.
The IETF recently adopted a standard on E2E encryption. Perhaps the law will mandate the implementation of MLS.
Source: https://www.ietf.org/blog/mls-secure-and-usable-end-to-end-encryption/
(there is also a quite good article on a German IT magazine, maybe check this out using DeepL)
It won't, not exactly. The law doesn't require that you be able to message between, say, WhatsApp and iMessage. It only requires that those services allow connections from outside their walled gardens by publishing APIs. Those APIs will spell out what's expected of the client in terms of encryption schemas.
Oh then thanks for the correction
L.O. fucking L.
One thing I think people are expecting is that, say, all WhatsApp users will suddenly by free to chat with all iMessage users. All these laws will require is that the services publish APIs that third parties can use. My guess is we'll see more services like Beeper that let you hook into iMessage, WhatsApps, RCS, etc from a single interface. Maybe WhatsApp and iMessage will eventually federate with each other but I doubt it and the law doesn't require it.
I didn't think the DMA would affect me for some time, but then it struck me that I will finally be able to interact with all the people using WhatsApp (there are a lot), so I'm excited to see how that will go.
I have no idea how they are counting it but I think there might be a grain of truth to this. iPhone users don't choose iMessage specifically, it's the default when texting other iPhone users. But how many people in Europe use SMS these days? It's all WhatsApp, Messenger etc.
Apple has the exact number. They could have released it to give the claim more weight.
As it stands I find it hard to believe that less than 45 million people in the EU use the service monthly. I assume they use a definition of "active users" that pushes the number artificially down. Whether or not that definition is inline with the definition by the EU is something we will have to find out.
As it stands I find it hard to believe that less than 45 million people in the EU use the service monthly
I believe it. Iphone has pretty low market share in EU and most people use third party apps like whatsup. So even iphone users are forced to use those third party apps.
I think a demographic analysis would be more important. If imessage only has 20% share in total but 60% among teens, then that should be enough to be to be considered gatekeeper. Especially considering that those teens will eventually grow up and probably carry that market share into adulthood.
I do not know a single person who uses iMessage. Europe uses Signal or WhatsApp. With an iPhone market share of 26 %, it just isn't viable. People like to use a single (or at most 2) messaging app. No point in using iMessage.
Even not considering this, the EU has 448 Million people and a smartphone penetration of roughly 85 %. So if every iPhone user would use iMessage, this would bring the number to 448 * 0.85 * .26 = 99 Million. I highly doubt more than half of the iPhone users use iMessage.
iPhones aren't the only products that can use iMessage. You have apple watches and iPads on top of it. Which puts the potential uses way up.
While iPhones might have a market share below 30% in the EU as a whole, the share varies a lot in individual countries. In Poland it's just 10% while in Denmark it's above 60%.
And iPhones tend to appear in clusters. In my experience they aren't evenly distributed. I know of families where everyone uses iPhones while in my family no one has. So any kind of personal experience is rather pointless.
Until numbers are publicized, I still find it hard to believe that fewer than 45 million people use iMessage a month. I fully believe that fewer than 45 million people use it daily. So it comes down to how you define active users. And Apple will almost certainly use a strict definition of what counts as an active users to reduce the number.
At least in my bubble iPhone users don‘t use iMessage among each other either
It's probably true that not many people use the IM portion of iMessage in the EU. In my experience, I've never actually seen anyone use it.
That being said, since it's the default SMS app, you can't convince me that most iPhone users don't use it al least once a month (even if just to get a one time code from the bank). It's definitely more than 45 million users, at least for the SMS part of the app.
I'm not trying to defend Apple, but arguably that's an entirely different system that just happens to be packed into the same UI. It's deeply integrated which I find worrying, but doesn't really mean that if I get a SMS text for security verification that I'm "using iMessage" in any real sense.
Last time I sent an SMS was like 7 years ago or something like that.
Companies still use them to send you verification codes (which depending on your country can be a mayor security risk) and reminders, but otherwise it's mainly WhatsApp or other messagers like Telegram or Signal.
Quick info: It's major not mayor.
One thing is big, the other is a person acting big.
In the EU, Android is much more dominant than in the US, so it makes sense that iMessage isn’t used much.
Even with people who currently have an iPhone I personally don’t use it, because they might switch to Android in the future.
The whole iMessage saga is the dumbest thing I've heard. It's text messaging bub...if that's what keeps someone on your platform, then they were never looking to leave.
It's automatically replacing SMS when texting iPhone users and supports plenty of modern features like group chats, embedding media etc. iMessage has an actual stranglehold in the US where teenagers have to use it not to be left out from their social circles (group chats are pretty much broken for anyone not using it). So called green bubble (SMS) vs blue bubble (iMessage) puts pressure since it's a bit of a status symbol too.
If the same was happening in the EU it would make sense to scrutinize it under new regulation. I'd wage 90% wouldn't notice if their messages were delivered as plain SMS though.
90% don't use iMessage here becaise everyone and their grandmother uses Whatsapp. iMessage will still fall under this regulation despite low actual users becaise it's a pre-installed app that also handles sms and plenty of companies send you text messages.