this post was submitted on 14 Sep 2024
213 points (71.3% liked)

Memes

45578 readers
1293 users here now

Rules:

  1. Be civil and nice.
  2. Try not to excessively repost, as a rule of thumb, wait at least 2 months to do it if you have to.

founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
 
top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] [email protected] 86 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (3 children)

Alaska, a red state, is reportedly trying to remove their rank choice voting. This isn't a "Dems" problem, it's a two party problem.

https://ballotpedia.org/Alaska_Ballot_Measure_2,_Repeal_Top-Four_Ranked-Choice_Voting_Initiative_(2024)

Even if state and local elections are ranked choice, the presidential election will still be a first past the post election and the electoral college is still designed for a two party system.

[–] [email protected] 26 points 1 month ago (3 children)

Obviously the Republicans are completely hostile to rcv, but the nominal progressives here aren't hoping the Republicans will implement rcv, they think Dems will. I have someone arguing exactly that to me in another thread because three congresspeople are currently setting a proposal up to be shot down.

load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 67 points 1 month ago (3 children)

My city had ranked choice voting implemented by Democrats in the 1970s. They elected the first black mayor, who is still one of our most beloved mayors in the city's history, under RCV.

Then Republicans made it illegal at a state level when they had a trifecta. Democrats keep introducing bills at the state level to allow RCV, and Republicans take more and more drastic action against it. So yeah... I want more Democrats in my state government so we can have RCV.

load more comments (3 replies)
[–] [email protected] 64 points 1 month ago (17 children)

Right on. Once the republicans have enough of a majority they will deal with all these voting problems.

load more comments (17 replies)
[–] [email protected] 64 points 1 month ago (5 children)

Someone's unwillingness to implement an effective solution doesn't make an ineffective solution the answer.

The way forward on this is hounding them until they implement it, not fighting the math:

https://youtu.be/s7tWHJfhiyo

[–] [email protected] 10 points 1 month ago (1 children)

If a solution doesn't have a realistic path to implementation, it doesn't matter. The system itself is designed against change, RCV is something neither party actually wants.

Some few Democrats or states are allowed to support it as far as it gives RCV supporters some semblence of power, without actually pressuring the system.

Even if RCV was implemented, and a Third Party candidate won, the 2 establishment parties would work against any radical change.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 month ago (1 children)

It pressures the system in those cities or states, which is actual pressure to the system, just not direct pressure on the federal government. History shows you can mount pressure through local and state changes until it gets overwhelming support on a federal level.

You can make the argument there might be more effective or quicker solutions, but this is unquestionably one path toward it.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 month ago (4 children)

My point is that tiny, inconsequential pressure is allowed so that you think it applies pressure. Whenever it gets close to making a difference, it won't.

load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (4 replies)
[–] [email protected] 60 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Those three Democrat are focusing on the thing all of the Democrats and Republicans should.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 month ago (1 children)

oh yes the standard reply.

Rs actively tearing it down like in Alaska

Ds putting forth a bill to do it but only started by three of them this time around

"both sides are the same!"

yawn

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 30 points 1 month ago (11 children)

The Dems will preserve a political model that's at least malleable. 3rds will need to work together to push ranked choice more and more into voters' field of view.

Republicans will swan-dive into fascism, in which case 3rds (and everyone else) are fucked.

Dems aren't going to help 3rds directly, but any one who wants the possibility of a 3rd party victory later is committing political suicide by failing to vote blue as a means of buying time. Voting 3rd when that 3rd has no potential for victory is self-destructive.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (3 children)

Also just following the green party a bit and educating your self about them... you learn that the green party is as focused on selfish personal horse race politics that deals with power plays, as the dem party (though on a smaller scale) instead of actual change.

This political cycle, Green party had a chance to radically push the Dems on palestine, by putting up a candidate that would drop out if Dems changed their position on support for Israel.

Jill Stein rejected it.

Just the fact they rejected it shows to me that they're not serious about actual political change. They just want to be a spoiler. They continue to only run in general elections instead ofnpushing in states.

So I guess i have no home party, but Ill vote for the lesser of two evils still.

load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (10 replies)
[–] [email protected] 25 points 1 month ago (12 children)
load more comments (12 replies)
[–] [email protected] 24 points 1 month ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 month ago

To the surprise of nobody Republicans also don't support a voting system that would end the Democrat-Republican duopoly.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 1 month ago (2 children)

New York City established Ranked Choice voting in 2020 under a Dem Mayor and majority Dem City Council.

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 month ago

Isn't what they established in Alaska thanks in large part to democrats???

Edit: lol, seeing a lot of downvotes but I'm not seeing anybody refuting it either. Feel free to prove me wrong of course!

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 month ago (1 children)

There's a "Vote No on Ranked Choice Voting" sign on my way to work.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Someone just needs to paint over the word ‘no’

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (1 children)

I'm not sure if it's legal to deface political signs like that.

Edit: it's very much not

https://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=29a.84.040

[–] [email protected] 21 points 1 month ago (7 children)
load more comments (7 replies)
[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 month ago

Some will at small, minor levels, but never enough to cause a serious threat. It's like how it's socially permissible and legal to make worker co-operatives and the like, the fact that it's non-threatening to the status quo keeps it a useful carrot that will never arrive at a scale that causes drastic change.

[–] carpelbridgesyndrome 5 points 1 month ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 month ago

Gotta give people their Two Minutes Hate or they might remember that voting for Democrats is, for most Americans, the actual least evil option on November 5.

load more comments
view more: next ›