this post was submitted on 14 Mar 2024
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Mildly Infuriating

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(Title shamelessly stolen from this comment in the crossposted [email protected] thread.)

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[–] [email protected] 96 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (5 children)

Umm that's not exactly what they're saying.

It would update a 27-year-old law to create three new classes of electric bikes based on the type of motor and how fast they can go.

Hell the ACTUAL statute is just defining what a e-bike is. You can see it here: https://olis.oregonlegislature.gov/liz/2024r1/Measures/Overview/HB4103

It does say class 1 can be operated by anyone, but 2 and 3 can be limited to 16 and older. Yes that's more restrictive then the past, but really it's "Defining the e-bikes" because they were poorly defined based on an almost hundred year old law.

That being said it does limit the top speed of an e-bike to 28 miles an hour, I assume above that it's now a motocycle, and honestly, that might be a good thing, because at that speed they no will come out of no where (hell at 20-30 miles an hour they still will)

This is hardly as bad as the title.

[–] [email protected] 48 points 9 months ago

So it's literally to prevent 9 year olds going 50 on an e-bike. Seems fair to me.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 9 months ago

Damn 1997 was 100 years ago? How time flies...

[–] [email protected] 5 points 9 months ago (4 children)

Do they at least require insurance on anything that goes faster than 15 mph or similar?

[–] Patches 4 points 9 months ago

If only.

Maybe we could get signage that clearly displays a bike's information such that a hit & run wouldn't be impossibly easy. Maybe we could make it made of Metal so it's durable. Call it a License Plate.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 9 months ago (26 children)

As far as I read/understand, nope. But if it does limit the assistance to 28 miles an hour, that might be required if the bike goes above that speed. (Note: that's only the point where the power would stop assisting, not the fastest speed the bike can do.)

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[–] [email protected] 44 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (8 children)
[–] [email protected] 6 points 9 months ago

"It is literally impossible for us not to harvest your data and sell it, so you can't come in".

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[–] [email protected] 26 points 9 months ago

This honestly makes me furious:

A 15-year-old boy... e-bike

the teen was riding with a passenger on the back.

They were riding ... on the sidewalk

The teen who died was not wearing a helmet, police said.

[–] [email protected] 24 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (6 children)

They were riding it on a sidewalk, through a crosswalk and someone turned into them. Of course.

One caveat I'll say is that depending on how fast they were going the laws should be that they should be with traffic, because if I'm driving and I look right I may not notice someone going 40+ mph on a sidewalk. But even then the law should be "Where do ebikes belong" officially

[–] [email protected] 35 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (6 children)

Someone going 40+ MPH is doing what amounts to riding a small motorcycle down a sidewalk. That's no longer a "bicycle" thing. Imagine the howling and pearl-clutching we would be reading if someone were caught blasting, say, a Honda Grom down a sidewalk like that. Which is already illegal, for obvious reasons.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 9 months ago (6 children)

I own an ebike and I use it on the mixed use trails in my city. Mostly I have it because I often pull my kids on a trailer bike and we have hills in town.

I fear that my riding on these trails will soon be banned because people are out there driving stupidly fast on big knobby-tired motorcycles masquerading as “e-bikes.”

There are tons of Karens pushing strollers on these trails and any election now they’re going to ban my bike.

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[–] [email protected] 21 points 9 months ago (15 children)

One of the many reasons you don't ride anything on the sidewalk is that you cross driveways and crosswalks too quickly to be seen by drivers. Even a standard bike should be ridden in the road, because 15 mph is fast enough to "come out of nowhere" and be hit by a car. All bikes are road vehicles.

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (4 children)

In NYC, maniacs ride ebikes and mopeds on both the sidewalk and the street as it benefits them. Every time I walk my dog I have to dodge the fuckers going full speed down the sidewalk. And they always glare at the pedestrians like you're the problem.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 9 months ago (2 children)

One caveat I’ll say is that depending on how fast they were going the laws should be that they should be with traffic, because if I’m driving and I look right I may not notice someone going 40+ mph on a sidewalk. But even then the law should be “Where do ebikes belong” officially

40mph is twice as fast as the max (motor assist) speed of a normal class 2 e-bike, but yeah, the real problem here is lack of proper bike infrastructure.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 9 months ago

It is trivial to kit-build an e-bike that will do this. Hell, I have one myself, constructed out of a Warp DS2 frame.

But the difference is, I also have an M endorsement and I treat my monster bicycle as a motorcycle. The law doesn't -- that's actually impossible in my state, so my bike falls in between a registrable motor vehicle and a bicycle. It also has turn signals, a car horn, a headlight, and working brake lights. But I also don't ride it like a dickhead, and that includes paths set aside for non-fire-breathing bicycles, sidewalks, etc.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 9 months ago

My city has amazing bike infrastructure: mixed use trails with no cars, bike lanes on all streets, tunnels and bridges over major thoroughfares (really it’s pretty insanely good and yes it’s in the US of fucking A).

People still ride on the sidewalks like morons. They ride the wrong direction in the bike lanes.

Bike infrastructure is essential but also not totally sufficient. You need a significant enough number of people using them that there is a culture for it and tribal sharing of knowledge around it.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 9 months ago

I hate cyclists that masquerade as pedestrians. It’s less safe for them and it’s less safe for everyone. Get your ass out into traffic and learn to take up some space. Ride defensively. Get yourself a rear view mirror. Pick the most bike friendly route. For fucks sake.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 9 months ago

I once made a left turn through a gap in the crowd downtown, then out of the ongoing crowd zips out a bike the opposite way out of nowhere. He almost hit the side of my car and of course he got mad at me, even though he was on the sidewalk which is illegal in my city, and he was riding against traffic

[–] ArbitraryValue 11 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

I don't know about Oregon, but I see how people ride their e-bikes here in NYC and it makes me suspect that most e-bike/car collisions are the e-bike's fault.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 9 months ago (8 children)

I'm from Toronto, same. Also as a pedestrian, those ebikers scare me the way cars scare them. They're not allowed on the sidewalk in my city, but you'll be walking with your toddler and an ebike speeds past you on the sidewalk almost hitting you. And they'll switch between sidewalk and road depending on the traffic, so I have no love for ebikers.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 9 months ago (1 children)

And they’ll switch between sidewalk and road depending on the traffic, so I have no love for ebikers.

This is the problem I have with bikes. They want the pros of pedestrians and vehicles without the cons of either.

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Oh no, sensible regulation on e-bikes. Although the initial proposal was better. Splitting the bikes into classifications. And then splitting the eligibility by class (class 1 for any age) and class 2 and 3 for 16 and older.

The accident was horrible but also weird. Biking on the sidewalk? next to a highway?? With turns??? It just reads bizarre and like a traffic system that is very hostile to anything but cars.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (4 children)

Remember that for state governments, "Highway" is a term of art that does not necessarily mean "elevated controlled access high speed multilane thoroughfare with on and off ramps" but usually more along the lines of, "anything paved, but not dirt." And the cops parrot this to make themselves sound like they're very officious and totally not useless doughnut-eaters, and then news outlets follow suit.

For example, my state's laws consistently use the word "highway" to refer to all paved roads that are under the purview of the state (i.e. not private roads, county roads, or municipal roads), even if they're not wide enough to have a center stripe. Then what we'd think of as a highway I believe is referred to as a "controlled access freeway."

Here is the location in question. This is definitely a Stroad, and it is certainly not a freeway. Stroads are well known to be hostile to pedestrians and cyclists. It also appears to have non-separated bike lines, i.e. some asshole just came by and painted bike icons on the existing shoulder, calling it job done.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 9 months ago

Thanks for that tidbit of background. Much appreciated. The location does seem hostile to anything other than cars.. that's a stroad for you.

All that space can easily fit a protected bikelane and pavement on either side with a row of trees on the separator between the bikelane and the carlane.. such a waste.

Obligatory, stroads are stupid.

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 9 months ago

They're not actually. They just needed to define what e-bikes are as a by-the-by because so far it had not been defined.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 9 months ago (2 children)
[–] [email protected] 7 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

"Well we clearly need to make it even more illegal then" -The Government

(Although technically was 16 year olds not allowed to ride e-bikes? If so then this is more permissive, because it says 16 year olds can ride class 1 bikes)

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[–] [email protected] 4 points 9 months ago (1 children)

The bill creates three classifications of electric bicycles. Class 1 ebikes only provide assistance when a rider is actively pedaling and stops its motor when the bike reaches 20 mph. Class 2 ebikes can be propelled without pedaling and top out at 20 mph. And Class 3 ebikes require pedaling, come with a speedometer and top out at 28 mph.

Levy initially proposed allowing anyone, regardless of age, to use a Class 1 electric bicycle and making it a traffic violation for a child younger than 16 to use a Class 2 or Class 3 ebike. But as passed by the House, the bill would ban ebikes for anyone younger than 16 who doesn’t have a driver’s license or permit. Anyone 16 or older can use any ebike.

Hmmm. I think high school is when there might be a real need for an Ebike so I'd go with that age.

What age can you get a driver's license? Does a learners license count?

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