this post was submitted on 14 Jan 2024
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[–] [email protected] 186 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Clickbait, he tweeted “inaccuracy in the ASUS router tool” later on.

[–] [email protected] 123 points 10 months ago (3 children)

In a follow-up post a day after his initial Tweet, Johnie noted “inaccuracy in the ASUS router tool,” with regard to Apple iMessage data use. Other LG smart washing machine users showed device data use from their router UIs. It turns out that these appliances more typically use less than 1MB per day.

the writer knew that the stats were bunk, yet wrote the article anyway. the site knew this, too, tacked-on the clickbait headline and published it. toms really has gone to shit the last few years--at least under the current ownership (last changed hands 2018).

[–] [email protected] 18 points 10 months ago (3 children)

Speaking of which, it uses the same web interface as a lot of other news sites. Newsletter popup, autoplay video part-way down that then jumps to the top of the screen, etc. What Hifi is the same, and there are various other sites all with the same annoying engine. Two questions: (1) are all these sites owned by the same company and (2) is there a browser extension that can fix them?

[–] [email protected] 9 points 10 months ago

yes, it's the same ownership (scroll down to the bottom). they have dozens of sites. don't know of any specific addons to help with them, though. custom ublock origin rules, perhaps.

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

and here we are 17 hours later with it as one of the top stories on this site.

We are soooooooo reddit 2.0.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 10 months ago

And OP presumably read the article, knew there was no actual story, and posted it here anyway.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 10 months ago

Thanks for saving me the click.

[–] [email protected] 61 points 10 months ago (19 children)

Anybody in his right minds wouldn't connect a washing machine to WiFi in the first place.

[–] [email protected] 22 points 10 months ago (4 children)

I'd connect it to wifi maybe. I wouldn't connect it to the Internet.

When it comes to home automation I'm generally onboard, but it's local control or nothing.

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[–] [email protected] 16 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (7 children)

I dunno about you, but I would love to get a notification on my watch when the machine has finished it's cycle. The stupid high pinched repeated beeping noise sucks... especially when it's the next door neighbour's washing machine and they're not even home, so it goes on and on for fucking hours. And I'd like to see proper error descriptions on my phone, instead of just "UE" on the timer LCD. WTF is a "UE" error?

If we're going to get really fancy... I'd love to be able to load the machine in the morning, but tell it to actually start running several hours later while I'm at work. I obviously don't want clean wet clothes going mouldy in the washing machine all day... but I don't really want to run the washing machine when I'm home either, because it's noisy.

Remote activation would also be better for the environment and also better for my clothes - I'd use the the slow gentle economy cycle every time if I could remotely trigger it at 3pm on a weekday. I'm definitely not going to use that on the evenings (when I'll be asleep in 3 hours) or on weekends (when I don't know if I'll be home in 3 hours time).

A wifi connected washing machine sounds like a great feature to me, and I'd happily pay for it (with dollars, not with an invasion of privacy). I guess that means I won't be buying an LG.

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 10 months ago (1 children)

As an appliance repair man if 20 years don't ever connect your application to the wifi.

Knowing what part of the cycle your washing machine is in at all times is useless information.

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[–] [email protected] 39 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (6 children)

Well the missing socks have to get sent somewhere... /s

[–] [email protected] 18 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Yes, socks can turn into a lot of data really fast, especially if they are multithreaded. Which is why I only use single threaded socks to protect my dataplan.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 10 months ago (1 children)

So much for my fibre connection...

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 10 months ago (3 children)

Given that one sperm has 27.5 MB of data (which means each orgasm has over 7 petabytes of information!) I think we can safely assume which socks his washer is transmitting.

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[–] spaghettiwestern 36 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (10 children)

LG's app is an absolute privacy nightmare too. That app must be used if you want access to any smart appliance features and it requires precise location permissions 100% of the time. Even then, the app features are mediocre, it doesn't work very well and often doesn't notify of a finished wash load until long after it's completed.

Why anyone would want to allow their washing machine manufacturer to continuously track their exact location in exchange for some crappy, poorly implemented features is beyond me.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 10 months ago

Thanks for pointing out the location service thing. I just killed that shit.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 10 months ago

The LG app also checks SafetyNet/Play Integrity so you can't use it with root. They probably fear that you can then unleash how much more of a privacy nightmare it is.

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[–] [email protected] 34 points 10 months ago (13 children)

No it couldn’t. My washing machine cant connect to my network! I can’t think of a valid reason why I would even want that.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 10 months ago (6 children)

I can think of a very valid reason. I very often forget that I ran the washing machine, I'm already investigating how to send a notification to my phone or computer after it is done. Right now I am checking how much electricity it consumes and when it stops doing it. But a API would be nicer.

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

I tried it with our dish washer, just to see what it's about. Turns out it's all about nothing. It's absolutely void of any useful functionality.

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[–] [email protected] 33 points 10 months ago
[–] [email protected] 26 points 10 months ago (5 children)

It really irritates me when IoT devices force you to use "the cloud" for access. My home automation consists of roughly 100 devices. The vast majority are Zigbee, but a few use wifi. With the exception of my irrigation controller, all the wifi devices are blocked at the firewall from accessing the internet. The fact that I have to send a command half way across the country to a remote server only so it can send it right back to my home network when I want to change the watering schedule for my plants is ridiculous. Sure, I could buy a different controller, but I already spent $300 once. I'm not doing it again.

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[–] [email protected] 26 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Imagine spending extra money on a new clothes washer only to have someone turn it in to a crypto miner. 😬

[–] [email protected] 13 points 10 months ago

I'm too lazy to come up with a witty money laundering joke.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 10 months ago (8 children)

Why are people connecting their machines to wifi in the first place?

[–] merc 15 points 10 months ago (5 children)

I can understand wanting it on your local network. Being able to check remotely how much time is remaining. Getting alerts if it needs maintenance. In a big house with multiple family members all doing laundry, just checking to see if the machine is in use before hauling all your stuff down could be nice. But, that info doesn't need to leave the house. I don't know why you'd want that information leaving the house.

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 10 months ago

It's starts with a sales pitch (not just to you, it's sales pitches all the way down) about how the washer can send the user status, maybe let them schedule, etc. They probably have an app to pair with it to keep it all in-house. One thing leads to another, every appliance gets wifi and sends a ton of data to a totally undoubtedly secure and anonymous centralized server full of harmless data for the sake of saving the customer 15 steps.

Big Brother didn't ride in on the back of a commie tank, he was invited in for the slightest increase of convenience.

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[–] [email protected] 21 points 10 months ago (2 children)
[–] [email protected] 27 points 10 months ago

The 'S' in IoT stands for security

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[–] [email protected] 20 points 10 months ago

Plot twist: it was the Asus router misreporting the amount of data.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Until a robot can hang up my washing, my machine is staying off any networks

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 10 months ago (9 children)

Bought “smart” LG fridge, range and dishwasher a couple of years ago and never connected any of them, they function like they are supposed to, refrigerate, heat food and clean dirty dishes. No need to connect.

Fridge manual explained something like “in case of peak energy consumption your smart energy company can send a signal to your fridge to not use power”. What the heck do I need that for? To find spoiled food and mold growing in the fridge later on?

Why does one need to connect a range to WiFi?

[–] [email protected] 10 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

Some people have hourly electric pricing, in their case it's worth scheduling stuff based on predicted pricing. How that should work is that you'd have a home server which controls your IoT stuff (so the gadgets themselves can be firewalled from the internet and controlled only by you) and then your server would fetch pricing data and pause stuff that doesn't need to run when prices are high and run stuff like washing when it's cheap

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[–] [email protected] 16 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Thats gonna me my new excuse when I loose in CoD. The washing machine was clogging up the Network.

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[–] [email protected] 14 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (10 children)

If you buy a "smart" washing machine and actually connect it to the internet, you deserve what you get.

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[–] merc 12 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (2 children)

There are probably 3 main groups of people with WiFi appliances:

  1. The vast majority of people don't care, and put it on their normal WiFi router and would never notice something like this
  2. A smaller group of people don't care much, but pay attention to their bandwidth usage and would spot an appliance trying to send 3.7 GB of data a day
  3. A much smaller group of people are paranoid and would put the device on its own isolated subnet, or use firewall-type features to limit the access their appliances have to the Internet.

My guess is that if this were a widespread problem, people in the second group would notice, or would have immediately checked and chimed in and said "holy crap, mine is doing this too". I didn't hear many people saying that, so I'm guessing this is a bug, and it's either a one-off weirdness, or it's a bug related to people in group 3 who are blocking their appliances from being able to connect to the Internet.

It's probably something as simple as a badly programmed firmware update check that doesn't do exponential backoff when it fails. It probably connects, fails, then immediately tries again. A proper exponential backoff would wait before trying again, and if it failed again it would double the wait time down to some minimum value like once per day or something.

Incidentally, this is also why claims about smartphones monitoring people's conversations when they're supposedly off is BS. That would require either huge amounts of bandwidth to transmit all the conversations, or huge amounts of computing power inside the phone to decode the voices. Either way you'd be using tons of battery, and probably a significant amount of bandwidth. There are enough paranoid people out there that if this were a real thing, someone would have caught the devices doing it by now.

[–] [email protected] 17 points 10 months ago (2 children)

I think the largest group by far isn't listed: people who bought an appliance and didn't care at all that it had WiFi and never connected it their network.

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[–] [email protected] 14 points 10 months ago

The article gets into what actually happened.

Dude’s Asus router was incorrectly reporting bandwidth usage.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 10 months ago (6 children)

The issue with web IpT is that devices send data reports of their status every fraction of a second. The packet may just be a few bytes but over time it adds up. Instead I wished they could just send status when they change state and wait for a confirmation but that’s harder to code…

[–] [email protected] 10 points 10 months ago (4 children)

If (Status != Prev_Status) {Send_All_User_Data();}

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[–] [email protected] 11 points 10 months ago (3 children)

A: Why would a washing machine have internet access? B: If it has the option, why would You even connect it to the internet? C: If it has to be connected to the internet, why would You even buy it?

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[–] [email protected] 11 points 10 months ago

I have a similar model washer/dryer and refuse to put it on my wifi. I only want it to wash and dry.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 10 months ago (8 children)

Just put the device on a separate wifi without internet access, or look at the "child protection" features of your router. Ours can put devices based on their MAC into "access groups" which range from "full access" over "internet from \ to " to "no internet at all".

[–] [email protected] 10 points 10 months ago (2 children)

The article mentions that his router is probably to blame.

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 10 months ago (3 children)

Why a washing machine need the connect to the Internet in the first place?

[–] [email protected] 17 points 10 months ago (5 children)

So that they can call it "smart" and charge more for it.

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[–] JohnDClay 9 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Was it being used as a node in a botnet? Or did it glitch somehow to keep sending over and over again? I can't image that behavior is nominal for that washing machine.

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