this post was submitted on 23 Jan 2024
228 points (97.9% liked)

Canada

7106 readers
223 users here now

What's going on Canada?



Communities


🍁 Meta


πŸ—ΊοΈ Provinces / Territories


πŸ™οΈ Cities / Regions


πŸ’ SportsHockey

Football (NFL)

  • List of All Teams: unknown

Football (CFL)

  • List of All Teams: unknown

Baseball

Basketball

Soccer


πŸ’» Universities


πŸ’΅ Finance / Shopping


πŸ—£οΈ Politics


🍁 Social & Culture


Rules

Reminder that the rules for lemmy.ca also apply here. See the sidebar on the homepage:

https://lemmy.ca


founded 3 years ago
MODERATORS
 

Most Canadians who plan on voting for the Liberal party are more motivated to stop the Conservatives from winning the election rather than endorsing the party's vision and leader, according to a new poll released on Monday.

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] mindbleach 16 points 7 months ago (2 children)

Ballot reform, for fuck's sake.

Approval Voting is where you check every name you like. Most votes wins. It's genuinely that simple, and there's no good reason what-so-ever it's not the global default.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 7 months ago (2 children)

Wow. It's hard to find a voting system I like less than FPTP, but you've found it! This only makes sense over STV if we don't have computers.

[–] mindbleach 7 points 7 months ago

STV only makes sense for multi-winner elections. It fundamentally does not pick the best candidate - just the first who can scrape together sufficient support. A person can be literally everyone's second choice and still lose.

Approval is a straight improvement over FPTP - there is no good reason, at all, to prefer FPTP. It completely eliminates the way similar candidates cannibalize each other's votes. It minimizes self-defeating efforts to be "strategic" by ranking no-chance buttheads higher, or only giving your preferred frontrunner half a vote.

If you're gonna do ranked ballots to pick one candidate then use a Condorcet method.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 7 months ago

And this type of disagreement on what sort of system to move to is among the reasons the lukewarm effort Trudeau attempted fizzled out pretty much immediately.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Can there be negative votes? So that not voting matters too

[–] mindbleach 10 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Nope.

What you're looking for is called Score Voting. Approval is just yes-or-meh. It is the simplest form of Score, and yet, it avoids a lot of self-defeating behaviors, has less reported regret than other systems, and somehow matches Condorcet results pretty reliably.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Ennnh, I feel like ranked choice would be better.

[–] mindbleach 3 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago)

Ranked Choice is an objectively mediocre use of ranked ballots. A candidate can be everyone's second choice, and they're guaranteed to lose. They'd be eliminated immediately because RCV only counts top votes. You really want a Condorcet method like Ranked Pairs.

Consider the following election:

45% of people vote Alice > Bill > Charles.
35% of people vote Charles > Bill > Alice.
20% of people vote Bill > Charles > Alice.

FPTP says Alice wins, despite 55% of people preferring anyone else. Obviously terrible. Right?

RCV eliminates Bill and says Charles wins... despite 65% of people preferring Bill.

Condorcet says Alice v. Bill goes to Bill and Bill v. Charles goes to Bill so Bill wins.

As he should.