this post was submitted on 02 Sep 2023
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chapotraphouse

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Congrats! You have successfully done a brigading! Pat yourself on the back! Next seminar, we will be covering how to subtly deceive strategically-important redditors with a simple tactic they don’t know of called ‘whataboutism’ sicko-hexbear

Edit: meant to post this in the secret group chat where we coordinate the fall of the west. Sorry y’all. My bad deeper-sadness

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[–] [email protected] 27 points 1 year ago (3 children)

God I hate whataboutism. Because no really what about it? Why are you comfortable taking such blatantly hypocrytical stances arrrrg. It just seems like a way to ignore valid critiques

[–] [email protected] 37 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

I can't find it, but a few years ago a user here did an effortpost showing how whataboutism was first used by the British to silence claims of wrongdoing in Ireland, and then quickly adopted and propagated by the CIA as a way to obfuscate discussion.
soypoint-1 Whataboutismsoypoint-2

[–] [email protected] 14 points 1 year ago

For real, it seems like just a rhetorical move to establish a blatant double standard while pretending one has the moral high hround, and I doubt John Oliver knew what he was unleashing.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 year ago (2 children)

About a week ago on Hexbear someone was saying China was good, and I said it's not good if you're queer. They replied that America is even worse. To which I said, "I know, I'm trying to get my trans partner out of there so it isn't holocausted. China and America aren't the only two countries. Why do you think America is important to this discussion?"

I think that's what whataboutism should refer to. When someone tries to excuse bad behaviour through comparison to an irrelevant third thing. I see it all the time in Australia from climate apathiers who say "We shouldn't try to reduce our emissions because China won't". I always tell them "we're doing worse per capita than China is. And even if we weren't, wouldn't you want our country to be a global leader in something?"

[–] [email protected] 13 points 1 year ago
[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Take this with a grain of salt, as I am Chinese from a medium sized city (only like 13,000,000 population)

LGBT issues in China is not perfect, but it is getting better in larger cities and even my own. The case may be different in smaller cities, more religious places and rural areas, but it is getting normalised on Zoomer social media, and LGBT+ spaces exist in larger cities (that to my understanding do have a fair amount of chasers so not perfect). There are gay bars and such in Shanghai, that aren't exactly operating in secret from the CPC.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Yeah, that's not what I call good. I don't think there's a country on Earth I'd call good for queer people. Australia is pretty bad and I think that's worse than Australia.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago (1 children)

It is however improving instead of backsliding. Like it might be due to social circles I'm in but I don't see hordes frothing at the mouth at LGBT as paedophiles, groomers, or retweeting JK Rowling. It's slow but it's substantially better than what it was a decade ago, which is substantially better than a decade before that.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago

Well if that trend continues, then China will deserve praise in 10-30 years. But America has taught us there's no guarantee progress will always continue.