this post was submitted on 29 Sep 2024
290 points (97.1% liked)

Asklemmy

43773 readers
1357 users here now

A loosely moderated place to ask open-ended questions

Search asklemmy 🔍

If your post meets the following criteria, it's welcome here!

  1. Open-ended question
  2. Not offensive: at this point, we do not have the bandwidth to moderate overtly political discussions. Assume best intent and be excellent to each other.
  3. Not regarding using or support for Lemmy: context, see the list of support communities and tools for finding communities below
  4. Not ad nauseam inducing: please make sure it is a question that would be new to most members
  5. An actual topic of discussion

Looking for support?

Looking for a community?

~Icon~ ~by~ ~@Double_[email protected]~

founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] [email protected] 162 points 1 month ago (4 children)

Hitler lost WW2, the south lost the American civil war, and we haven't all nuked each other (yet)

[–] [email protected] 57 points 1 month ago (1 children)

the south lost the American civil war,

They've been trying to play the long game

[–] [email protected] 19 points 1 month ago

The cultural victory, if you will.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Pretty sure Japan wouldn't agree with that last point....

[–] [email protected] 34 points 1 month ago

No, it is genuinely a good point. The fact that its use so far has been entirely limited to the two that ended WW2 was certainly not a given. Some US military leaders wanted to use nuclear weapons in Korea.

The Korean War was so soon after WW2 that the strong taboo against the use of nuclear weapons hadn't yet taken hold, and the USSR had a miniscule stockpile, so the US could genuinely have done it with limited risk to themselves. The fact that they didn't use them is a really important turning point that helped build in the taboo against their use that has so far held to this day.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 month ago (1 children)

The south won the war when they killed Lincoln.

[–] [email protected] 34 points 1 month ago (1 children)

They killed Lincoln but they couldn't kill the abolitionist movement. Congress ratified three of the most progressive laws written in a century and the Freedman's Bureau took to the job of enfranchising and rehabilitating millions of black ex-slaves in the subsequent decade.

Pick up a copy of W.E.B DuBois's "The Souls of Black Folk". What he describes is, at it's heart, a revolution in how our country treated men and women of African descent. It set the foundation for the next century of civil rights and paved the way for a modern era in which the core racist underpinning of the country are totally upended.

That kind of fundamental change would not have been possible under a Breckinridge administration, nor would it have been possible if the Union had been crippled into submission at Gettysburg or Antitem.

Lincoln was the tip of the abolitionist spear and critical to what came after. But he was not alone. And he was by no means the most radical voice within his party. His martyrdom became the bloody shirt that Republicans rallied under long after the war had ended.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Wait, when you say Republicans, do you mean the organisation that Americans currently call the Grand Old Party, the GOP, the modern Republican Party? If so, I find it ironic that the party standing for freedom has evolved into the party that shields and encourages racists and criminals.

[–] gravitas_deficiency 7 points 1 month ago

The American parties in the American civil war that share the names with the current parties are largely ideologically inverted at this point.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 month ago

the party standing for freedom

That died with the Hayes Administration.