this post was submitted on 28 Sep 2023
39 points (84.2% liked)

Europe

8324 readers
1 users here now

News/Interesting Stories/Beautiful Pictures from Europe 🇪🇺

(Current banner: Thunder mountain, Germany, 🇩🇪 ) Feel free to post submissions for banner pictures

Rules

(This list is obviously incomplete, but it will get expanded when necessary)

  1. Be nice to each other (e.g. No direct insults against each other);
  2. No racism, antisemitism, dehumanisation of minorities or glorification of National Socialism allowed;
  3. No posts linking to mis-information funded by foreign states or billionaires.

Also check out [email protected]

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
top 12 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] [email protected] 19 points 1 year ago (2 children)

To date, France has installed border checks at every single one of its borders – in the name of combatting terrorism.

This is patently untrue.

What else is this article lying about?

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

This is patently untrue.

It's not technically correct since there's no controls at the border with Monaco (I think), but France does officially informed the EU that it has temporary controls at all other borders until the end of October.

New terrorist threats, increasing risk of terrorist organisations present on national territory targeting the Rugby World Cup taking place in September and October 2023, increase in irregular entry flows at the external borders (from the Central Mediterranean and the Western Balkans); internal borders with Belgium, Luxembourg, Germany, Switzerland, Italy, Spain

https://home-affairs.ec.europa.eu/policies/schengen-borders-and-visa/schengen-area/temporary-reintroduction-border-control_en

[–] bernieecclestoned 4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Says they are here as well

https://www.fragomen.com/insights/european-unionschengen-area-internal-schengen-border-checks-further-extended.html

EU source:

France 01/05/2023 - 31/10/2023 New terrorist threats, increasing risk of terrorist organisations present on national territory targeting the Rugby World Cup taking place in September and October 2023, increase in irregular entry flows at the external borders (from the Central Mediterranean and the Western Balkans); internal borders with Belgium, Luxembourg, Germany, Switzerland, Italy, Spain

https://home-affairs.ec.europa.eu/policies/schengen-borders-and-visa/schengen-area/temporary-reintroduction-border-control_en

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Except I’ve crossed the border with Belgium and Luxemburg five times in total since May and I have seen no controls.

Has anyone?

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago

The article says "installed border checks", not "walled off the entire border". The article gives no quantification given how many checks there actually are. You can only infer that there's at least one for every border.

With EU border it's always clear that you can cross the border if you want to. E.g. Denmark - until recently - checked me every time I drove across the border, but if I wanted to, I could have stopped kilometer off, and just walked. They didn't control foot traffic and the border fence is specifically designed to be easy to cross for humans (but not boars).

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

Haven't seen any border control either and we cross several borders between Belgium, France, Germany and Austria each year. The only border control I've ever seen is in Basel, Switzerland, and even that is never a big deal, they have never actually stopped us.

[–] thetreesaysbark 8 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

Schengen doesn't technically mean no borders though does it? It means right to go between countries without visa/passport and without a limit on days.

That's what I always thought anyway.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

The treaty includes an obligation to abolish regular border controls.

They can be temporarily reintroduced if needed, based on a proportionality requirement. The article argues this provision is being overused.

[–] bernieecclestoned 3 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

You are right

And it's affecting the free movement of goods and people, which is a key EU principle

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Schengen doesn’t technically mean no borders though does it? It means right to go between countries without visa/passport and without a limit on days.

Not really. That's under the roules of the single market/four freedoms/EEA. Schengen is a more or less separate thing and only governs border controls (which are generally outlawed but with exceptions). There are quite a few EEA countries that aren't in Schengen (Irelands, Romania, Bulgaria) and a few countries (Monacco, San Marino, the Vatican) that are not in the EEA but kinda participating in Schengen.

[–] thetreesaysbark 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Oh. I thought it was more specifically a passport thing, and that the citizens of non-schengen EEA countries would still need a passport to enter the Schengen countries, whilst members of the Schengen countries could re-enter with others forms of ID too.

I didn't realise Schengen basically outlaws borders. Thanks for educating me :)

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

The passports/ID cards are a different thing again. They're mostly EEA, but additionally there's some recognition with some neighboring countries (the Balkans) and most Europeans can use their credit-card-sized ID card if they want to vacation in destinations like Turkey.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_identity_cards_in_the_European_Economic_Area