this post was submitted on 24 Aug 2024
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Android

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[–] [email protected] 67 points 3 weeks ago (3 children)

How did google manage to make a version of linux more bloated than windows? It's almost impressive.

[–] [email protected] 27 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

For the same reason turning off a screen in Android works in less than a second and doesn't drain your battery in half an hour while modern standby still barely works in Linux: optimisations.

Android is made to cache and freeze processes when switching apps. The more RAM you have, the more apps can have ready to go in an instant. When an app gets swapped out to storage, it's very clearly noticeable, and many apps don't bother to store state either. The Android approach to slick multitasking is to open as many applications as can fit in RAM, which is why apps launch faster than many Linux applications, even on much faster SSDs.

RAM really isn't that expensive, and the power savings of rarely ever initialising applications is worth it.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

while modern standby still barely works in Linux: optimisations.

Steam Deck likes to have a word

[–] [email protected] 16 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

The Steam Deck does sleep very well, but as far as I know, it doesn't do low-power background stuff while in sleep mode (Android does this for notifications, Windows will try to download updates, etc.).

I think the Deck uses classic S3 sleep rather than S0ix sleep.

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[–] [email protected] 17 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 8 points 3 weeks ago

And telemetry

[–] [email protected] 5 points 3 weeks ago

Tbf the high ram usage wouldnt be a problem if it cached processes in it and used it to save battery but its just pure bloat. I think phones should have a coprocessor that handles notifications like what smartwatches do and that basically free battery. But android is also bloated because apps take a very long time to launch because of the jvm and java (thats what i heard at least, idk if this is actually why its slow) so everything is just left active. Also i think android strayed too far from linux, its basically just a worse version with a mobile ui and the support of a country sized company.

[–] [email protected] 47 points 3 weeks ago (3 children)
[–] [email protected] 68 points 3 weeks ago (15 children)

They have 16GB of RAM physically, 3GB is reserved for AI. So yeah, only 13GB is usable by regular apps, even if you don't care about any of the AI stuff.

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[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

I assume 13GB shared with all active apps and not 13 per app.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 7 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Yes. Lots of people here have much less than even 13GB physical ram. My Pixel 4a has 6GB. So reading a news about how apps have "only" access to 13GB sounds just weird when that's more than twice the total ram you have available.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

I agree about that but it's stupid that you only have access to 13 of 16 GB.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 weeks ago

If there's no way to disable the LLM then yes, I agree.

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[–] [email protected] 27 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (1 children)

Only? I have just 8 GB RAM on My PC.

And Android device which I am using to comment this have just 2GB RAM.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 3 weeks ago (3 children)

Chrome casually using 8gbs with a few tabs open. Also windows 11. I got a school laptop and windows uses 5gb out of the boxπŸ’€. Linux supremacy.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Chrome using 8gbs ram is not necessarily a bad thing

Usually browsers use a lot because nothing else is using the ram. If you had a separate program running, the browser would stop using as much.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 3 weeks ago

Shhh if you take away their illogical reasons to b**** about stupid things they'll find more annoying things to b**** about. Just nod and say yeah buddy too bad about that ram somebody should do something about that, and back away slowly.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 3 weeks ago

Firefox using way less than that for like 20 tabs…

[–] [email protected] 3 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Your OS is not necessarily using those 8gb, it just reserved them, meaning other apps can still use it

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[–] [email protected] 26 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (1 children)

Not a big deal.

Wait until you find out how much ram gets wasted in caching and algorithms designed to run faster on computers or improve productivity. Even things like indexing to speed up search or icon caching

It's a mobile phone. 13gb is lots, and I'd be curious to see the extent that ai improves productivity.

The headline is designed explicitly to bait arguments

[–] [email protected] 5 points 3 weeks ago

The problem is Android is fuckterrible at using RAM properly.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 3 weeks ago
[–] [email protected] 9 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

That's insane for so many reasons.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Reasons such as?

Phones don't need 16 GB of RAM.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 weeks ago

That's why it is insane. It is a crazy huge amount of ram that is eaten up like crazy.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

16GB of RAM sounded too good to be true. Granted 13GB is nothing for sneeze at still. Hopefully, they can provide an option to toggle it off. Sounds wasteful for people who would use it once a while.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

It does have 16GB of RAM, though, it just reserves 3GB of it for AI stuff. I don't know what kind of AI stuff needs to be loaded in the background continuously, but running the same apps on other phones will also drain 3GB out of the embedded 16GB of RAM.

I can't really think of a reason why someone would buy the most expensive "AI phone" and then never use AI. The other Pixel models don't have this stuff, so people who won't use AI should probably just get a cheaper phone.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 weeks ago

I bought it cause I wanted pink and I like larger phones smaller phones feel uncomfortable to hold I wish the AI stuff would get lost it's all nonsense that does nothing to improve anything and only slows you down and is an excuse for more spyware

[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 weeks ago

Just getting the 3GB of RAM used is not the issue. There are apps which can use even more. The issue is its reserved meaning its not available to your other apps.

An option to remove the lock while still being able to utilize the RAM (should the need arise) and AI features should be provided for flexibility should one desire.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 3 weeks ago

At least the OS seems to know that the additional memory is there. This means root apps or custom ROMs should be able to use all 16GB.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)
[–] [email protected] 11 points 3 weeks ago (4 children)

They only have a few MB reserved for Google's AI, most of the 12GB is free for all apps on other models.

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (1 children)

On the Pixel 8 Pro and Pixel 9, we note just 0.26GB (275,336KiB) of locked RAM [...], a very small amount most likely used for some background tasks in the OS. However, on the Pixel 9 Pro XL, this leaps to 2.91GB (3,051,936KiB) of Unevictable and Mlocked RAM. Subtract out the Unevictable RAM from the Pixel 9, and there’s an extra 2.64GB (2,776,603KiB) reserved on the Pro models.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Really interesting. I wonder what features the Pro XL has that the Pro version doesn't to use over 10 times more RAM.

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