this post was submitted on 17 Mar 2024
1392 points (99.6% liked)

196

16910 readers
1023 users here now

Be sure to follow the rule before you head out.

Rule: You must post before you leave.

^other^ ^rules^

If you have any questions, feel free to contact us on our matrix channel.

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
 
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Which is still an unprecedented power we've consistently called out other countries for doing. Also, targeting a single entity is unconstitutional, it's a Bill of Attainder.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago (1 children)

No. It isn't charging them with a crime, which is what a bill of attainder is for. It's only saying they won't be allowed to do business in the US. I'm fairly confident it is absolutely legal and constitutional, and also it isn't unprecedented either. For example, see Huawei.

You can argue ethics all you want. It won't stop anything, nor does it really matter in this situation. Ethics aren't in play, because this is about power. Regardless, it's equally ethical for the US to do this as what China does to prevent western companies operating in China.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

It imposes a punishment without trial. That's a Bill of Attainder.

And being as ethical as China isn't a line I want to stand on.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago (1 children)

You're missing a very key part of it, I assume on purpose. It imposes a punishment for a crime. No one is accusing them of a crime. I don't know where you got this idea from, but they're wrong. They may have said it very confidently, but it's incorrect. Doing this to "protect national security" is perfectly fine. The intent is not to punish them.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/bill_of_attainder

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (1 children)

Oh, that makes it okay then.

We're going to pass a law that punishes a someone or a group, but it's okay if we just don't say, "they're guilty of X."

Somehow I don't think the courts are going to share your interpretation. And in your own article they do not. Nowhere in the test does it state the bill must name a crime.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago (1 children)

The last bullet for determining if it's punishment: "Was that a congressional intent for the statute to further punitive goals."

It fails that test. It isn't any sort if punishment. It's for "national security".

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

Oh? Could have fooled me. The anti-China statements from politicians are admissable.

If the government is allowed to hand waive anything under "national security" then it's a short trip to the work camp for us all.