Men's Liberation
This community is first and foremost a feminist community for men and masc people, but it is also a place to talk about men’s issues with a particular focus on intersectionality.
Rules
Everybody is welcome, but this is primarily a space for men and masc people
Non-masculine perspectives are incredibly important in making sure that the lived experiences of others are present in discussions on masculinity, but please remember that this is a space to discuss issues pertaining to men and masc individuals. Be kind, open-minded, and take care that you aren't talking over men expressing their own lived experiences.
Be productive
Be proactive in forming a productive discussion. Constructive criticism of our community is fine, but if you mainly criticize feminism or other people's efforts to solve gender issues, your post/comment will be removed.
Keep the following guidelines in mind when posting:
- Build upon the OP
- Discuss concepts rather than semantics
- No low effort comments
- No personal attacks
Assume good faith
Do not call other submitters' personal experiences into question.
No bigotry
Slurs, hate speech, and negative stereotyping towards marginalized groups will not be tolerated.
No brigading
Do not participate if you have been linked to this discussion from elsewhere. Similarly, links to elsewhere on the threadiverse must promote constructive discussion of men’s issues.
Recommended Reading
- The Will To Change: Men, Masculinity, And Love by bell hooks
- Politics of Masculinities: Men in Movements by Michael Messner
Related Communities
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We hate Babylon, actually, and all the stupid things that money makes people do to each other because they forgot what it means to actually live as a real person in the real world, instead of chasing clout inside systems designed to ensure the house always wins, regardless of which banner it happens to be flying today, be it feminist, Marxist, capitalist, socialist, or whatever other asinine idea people who produce nothing real come up with to explain why someone else is to blame for the shit state of affairs.
And no, we very definitely do not hate women. We do very much hate what this shitty world turns women into, which is why we have worked ourselves to death to protect them from it in past generations. But that peace was broken, and now there's going to be hell to pay.
You hate "what women are turned into"???
What a pathetic excuse. Shameful, even.
Unfortunately, the homogenization of women works against them when they're all conditioned to be proud consumers living vicariously through those richer than them.
Willfully conditioning yourself to be special and small minded is an act of weakness. Your open jealousy of the wealth of others reeks of fear and shame. If all you desire is power over another, you sacrifice any power over yourself. There is no strength in desiring to cause harm, and that is the only thing you will find on this path.
What do you have to offer other than malice?
Edit: Your assumption that women only want riches and wealth proves that your views are rooted in hatred of capitalism. Oops.
🥱
Yeah, no. You might want to look into a 'crab mentality' and see how much you and your peers exhibit it.
Gonna block you now.
There you go guys; if you don't intentionally harm your peers, you're just a crab!
Sigh. I know I went a wee bit overboard, but I can't stand incel mentality. But still, bludgeoning him with words was clearly a failure on my part.
Anybody have advice on better approach to that side? I'm all ears...
David McRaney has some really good content on this topic. I recommend listening to his podcast episode called How Minds Change, about deep canvasing. He has a whole book by the same name, if you want to read more about it.
Edit: I should summarise the key points I've taken from consuming his content:
Having said all that, it's best in 1 to 1 conversations. Not sure how effective you can be on the internet, but I do think it's best to try to show understanding of other peoples views and steel man their arguments (opposite of straw man) while sharing your own views.
Thank you for the reminder. A few months back there was an article posted that made the argument that acting with compassion, as challenging as that might seem at times, is truly the only tactic that has been proven in any way effective.
Clearly, I did not keep that in mind.
Yes, I do hate when people have become so bitter with the world that they lash out at everyone and everything they touch. It happens to men too, and there's absolutely no shame in hating to see it happen to good people.
Explaining your reasoning for your prejudice doesn't help. Not to mention the clear implication that all women are corrupted, but not all men. Never occurred to you to look at people as distinct individuals? Maybe don't punish a person for somebody else's sins.
What are you even talking about? In the last few generations women gained so much agency, freedom, power and escaped so many constrains, why would you want to "protect" them from that?
Why would we want to protect them from being exploited to enrich someone who doesn't care about them, as just another wage slave (or worse)? You'll have to forgive me if I don't accept the idea that being provided for by someone who loves you is a form of slavery.