this post was submitted on 20 Jan 2025
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[–] [email protected] 0 points 16 hours ago (2 children)

No, pardons do not imply guilt.

Pardons can be issued when someone is believed to be innocent of any wrongdoing.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 8 hours ago (1 children)

Legally the SCOTUS ruled that accepting a pardon is an admission of guilt

[–] [email protected] 1 points 7 hours ago* (last edited 7 hours ago)

No, they didn't.

"Accepting pardon is an admission of guilt" is found as dicta (non-binding commentary) in Burdick v. United States (1915).

Recently, the courts explicitly rejected that interpretation.

Senior U.S. Circuit Judge David Ebel declined to adopt that "draconian" reading of Burdick, saying the statement was an aside, or dicta, in the court's overall holding on the legal effect of someone's unaccepted pardon.

Ebel said no court since had ever held that accepting a pardon was akin to confessing guilt and that the ruling instead simply meant that accepting one "only makes the pardonee look guilty by implying or imputing that he needs the pardon."

Furthermore, "actual innocence" is among the criteria used to determine who should be pardoned.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

in what world do they issue pardons (To release (a person) from punishment or disfavor for wrongdoing or a fault: synonym: forgive. from dictionary.com) to people that were never even considered to have been at fault or done no wrong??

[–] [email protected] 0 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

The dictionary definition is not the legal definition.

A pardon can be issued to anyone, and it prevents any government punishment for the activities mentioned in the pardon.

It does not matter who, if anyone, considers them "at fault".

[–] [email protected] 1 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

https://legaldictionary.net/pardon/

A pardon is a governmental decision to absolve an individual for a criminal conviction, often times freeing him from all or part of the punishment imposed at sentencing. Pardons are typically granted by the President, or by individual state governors, usually to absolve individuals, but may be granted, in certain circumstances, for groups of people. Federal pardons are granted by the President of the United States, and each state’s law dictates with whom the power to grant state pardons lies. To explore this concept, consider the following pardon definition.

Seems like it does indeed imply there is a crime and punishment .

[–] [email protected] 1 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

Not according to the SCOTUS:

The power of pardon conferred by the Constitution upon the President is unlimited except in cases of impeachment. It extends to every offence known to the law, and may be exercised at any time after its commission, either before legal proceedings are taken or during their pendency, or after conviction and judgment.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

either before legal proceedings are taken

that by itself says before they legal proceedings, stating that they should/could be charged with wrong doing. Not just for being good people, they are believed to be charged soon. If its a frivolous lawsuit it should be allowed to play out no need for a pardon in something that NO ONE THINKS YOU DID ANY WRONG. By granting the pardon you are saying that something is at least legally questionable and they could be charged. Again this all means that something that was illegal was going on and people can talk about that, even editorialize with this information and have a better root to believably with that the person was pardoned, so if there is no crime then they shouldnt have power to pardon anyone.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 14 hours ago* (last edited 14 hours ago) (1 children)

No, it does not say "if they are believed to be charged soon".

A pardon ends any possibility of charges. It does not matter if charges are imminent, theoretical, or even realistic. Likewise, a pardon does not mean "something is at least legally questionable and they could be charged."

The power to pardon is unlimited (except for impeachment). That means it can be issued for anything (except for impeachment). So if the President felt like it, it would absolutely be within his power to pardon you for the crime of killing Abraham Lincoln even though you weren't alive at the time. He could pardon you for anything you might have done on New Years, even if everyone knows you didn't do anything at all on New Years.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

So what was it issued for, if there is no crime at all, the president can just give you a hey you get one crime on me. And even in your thought process, they have to name it, what were the reasons given. Again these reasons would insinuate a crime was committed.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 14 hours ago* (last edited 14 hours ago) (1 children)

A pardon is issued to prevent any future punishment. It does not have to give any reasons and it does not have to acknowledge a crime was committed.

In our legal system, you are only considered guilty of something after conviction. So if a pardon prevents charges, then legally you were never guilty of anything.

Of course you are personally free to assume whatever you want. Some people assume only guilty people are arrested, others don't make that assumption. You can assume only guilty people are pardoned, but others don't make that assumption.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 hours ago (1 children)

So you are saying they give them a free crime, if its not declared at the time of the pardon they can just be like no it was for this murder of 800 people and no one can say otherwise.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 9 hours ago* (last edited 9 hours ago)

Sure, the president could do exactly that if he wanted to. For example, Hunter Biden was pardoned for anything he did between 2014 and today.

Of course pardons are always retroactive, so Hunter does not get a free crime spree after his pardon.

And presidential pardons only apply to federal prosecution. Murder is a state crime, so it is not covered by a presidental pardon.

But if Hunter lied on his IRS forms in 2018 or committed mail fraud in 2022 or hacked a federal database last week, then yeah he officially got away with it.