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Masochism (i.ibb.co)

submitted 1 week ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

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[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago (1 children)

Well alright, I'm choosing to disregard the fact that this is 90% insults and calling me a weirdo freak. Thanks for that, btw, I've put a lot of effort into expressing myself clearly across a lot of different comments here.

In the latter half of this comment, I articulated why I feel an easy mode actually does make playing the game worse, even if you don't select it. I also articulated why a simple scaling difficulty wouldn't really work.

And in the latter half of this comment (start at "But I also think games are art"), I expressed why I think an Easy mode hasn't been added, and wouldn't be the same experience.

To add to that final point, the reason I don't want others to play an easy mode isn't because I'm a loser and beating Souls is the only way I know I'm a real man. I just think Souls is an amazing and unique offering, and it would be a real shame for someone to play the game on easy (which would "break the game itself" in Miyazaki's words) and think that's all there was.

I want more people to give it a try and experience it, and hopefully love it, not less. But just like it's frustrating to watch a movie you love with someone who's on their phone the whole time, it would be frustrating to see a ton of people play a kneecapped version of one of my favourite things and end up not "getting it". And it would be more of a loss for them than me. It's just the same Miyazaki quote over again, both me and him love what has been made here, and want more people to experience it, but not at the expense of compromising it. To paraphrase the end of his quote, would we even be talking about it if From Soft hadn't had the confidence to stick to their intended vision?

“If we really wanted the whole world to play the game, we could just crank the difficulty down more and more. But that wasn’t the right approach,” he said.

“Had we taken that approach, I don’t think the game would have done what it did, because the sense of achievement that players gain from overcoming these hurdles is such a fundamental part of the experience. Turning down difficulty would strip the game of that joy - which, in my eyes, would break the game itself.”

[–] [email protected] 0 points 5 days ago (1 children)

90% calling you names? in the last 1/4 I brought up how it is weird to be bothered by the experience of others, when they don't affect you, then pushed for a reasoning of it, by laying down an array of possibilities, and then asking what yours was. I used the word weird twice, and it was in relationship to the behavior, not the person. My guy, you are way too sensitive, like you imagined something isn't there, if this is really how you viewed that comment.

There is more to scaling that just HP/Damage. It isn't that great of a challenge to add in more time for response, and reduce pattern complexity so you don't have memorize as much, or for as long. This is how many FPS games, Fighting games, and RTS games have done it for decades. No one bemoans Quake for having something other than nightmare, or Mortal Combat for having an easy option. Hell, in Sekiro, giving more time to respond for parries/blocks, and reducing the number needed, in order to execute the instant kill function, would have worked. There are many ways difficulty could be changed. Even if they did the dumb thing by reducing the HP of enemies, and increasing the damage you do, if normal is just as it was intended, how did it change your personal experience, since you wouldn't play the game?

It is possible to disagree, and have a discourse about it, with the creators. You don't have to accept artist/authorial intent as if it was the law of reality governing their product. I agree with him that people who enjoy those challenges will get more from a game than they would otherwise. However I think it is weird, maybe even self-centered in nature, to assume that everyone would get that increase in satisfaction, for the same reasons, as he does. He is free to say he doesn't want to do this, and people who play his games are free to disagree with him on the subject.

It appears we fundamentally disagree here.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

To say that an option for an easy mode, on the screen, when you start, that you do not have to select, would damage your experience, is wild. That is very, very, weird. You are adamant the idea that someone could have a variant in preferences, that affect you in no way, would damage your experience because what? Because you had to see the option on the screen? Because people you deem lesser gamers would have played it? Is this some weird ideological axiom? Because people are simply doing something different than you? What is it that bothers you so much about other people having a different choice, you don’t need to make, or experience?

I mean... quick recap here. You said the way I was behaving was "very, very weird". You claimed I was offended solely "because I had to see an option on the screen". You claimed my reasoning was about "lesser gamers being able to play it", clearly insinuating that I simply have a superiority complex as a "weird ideological axiom", as if it's the foundation of the way I think. You also basically stated that I'm deeply bothered by anyone having a different opinion or experience.

Don't try to gaslight me about this being insulting. I've never expressed any anger here at disagreement, nor have I brought up anything about superiority or inferiority. You're bringing baggage into this from other people you've argued with before, and then insulting my character over a strawman version of my argument.

Also, when you clearly associate a behaviour with a person, insulting that behaviour is insulting the person. You can't claim you didn't associate the two when you chose to write "YOU" in all caps several times while describing the behaviour you were insulting.

It's also not at all ridiculous to assume the "What is it that bothers you so much about other people having a different choice, you don’t need to make, or experience?" at the end of that rant was rhetorical like the questions preceding it, again, don't try to gaslight me into thinking that quote was purely "laying down an array of possibilities, and then asking what yours was", and that I'm being "sensitive".

If you actually didn't mean offence, then I'd encourage you in future to skip the "array of possibilities", especially when those possibilities are exclusively descriptions of assholes.

That aside, thank you, I actually do appreciate you recognizing that you can't just "double your health and damage" and get a good easy mode. That's an argument I frequently come across while having this discussion, that they could "just scale everything down" in an hour or so, it's become what I tend to assume people mean when they say "just add an easy mode". You're also a very different person than what I usually end up having this argument with, in that you have actually played Souls, and understand the value of the more challenging default, but still wanted an easy mode. In that sense, I'd have no issue if you had played an easy mode. There's lots of mods to do so, for example, and I wouldn't have any problem if you had gone and played one. Frankly, I wouldn't have issue with anyone installing a mod to play an easier version. The option is literally there, just not on console, unfortunately, but I blame the console manufacturers for that, not From Software. I like the clarity in installing a mod that you aren't playing the game as intended and getting the full experience, which means it doesn't "segment the user base" or potentially cause people to miss out by thinking they've experienced everything From Soft intended.

The argument I generally take issue with is that From Software have some kind of "moral responsibility" or are "stupid and losing business" for not adding an explicit easy mode. A half-baked easy mode would do more harm than good, in terms of review scores and giving many players a worse experience. And a well-made easy mode is not an insignificant amount of work. Balance is one of the hardest things to get right, From Soft is literally still doing balance patches on the base game of Elden Ring, and easy mode would essentially double the amount of situations where things have to be balanced. It would also double QA work, as every scenario needs to be tested in both difficulties. And just... loading different things conditionally into a space isn't always easy either, look at all the struggles and weird bugs id have experienced with DOOM Eternal's Master Levels, and they're a team lauded for their technical prowess. One of From Soft's best attributes is that they iterate very quickly. A team of ~400 people have made Dark Souls 1, 2, 3, Bloodborne and Sekiro and Elden Ring in 11 years. That's more than a game every 2 years, not even counting DLC and other projects, in an era where game development is trending towards 5+ years as the norm. I've already asserted that I don't feel an easy mode would be nearly the same quality of game as the main entry, so I'll come out and outright say that I don't think an easy mode would be worth the months of effort that properly balancing and tweaking such a mode to make it good would add to development. But that's totally subjective, and you're more than welcome to do that math differently.

If From Soft release their next title with an easy mode, then great. I won't go picket their office or anything, I'm not pathetic. But if they do, then I really hope it's good, and I really hope the people who finally "get" to play will give the intended difficulty a chance.