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Honey (mander.xyz)

submitted 2 days ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

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[–] [email protected] -1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

No, I can't save them. Because systematic problems cannot be solved through individual action

That being said, it's bold of you to assume someone conscious of the suffering of plants isn't eating as sustainably as they can with the choices they have available

Also, this is about honey - honey production encourages freely planting wild fields rather than mono crops, and it discourages killing the bees. I don't share your moral system, but in mine this is about as good as it gets

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 day ago (1 children)

That being said, it’s bold of you to assume someone conscious of the suffering of plants isn’t eating as sustainably as they can with the choices they have available

Oh so you are a vegan?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 15 hours ago (1 children)

No, I just eat very little meat. Most of my meals are rice and beans with whatever veggies I have on hand mixed in, preferably locally grown. I'll also add in eggs sometimes, which unfortunately don't come from a local source because I don't have one anymore

And occasionally I go out for a burger or sushi, but I do it rarely and consciously. I enjoy it even more because of that And by framing it this way, I've convinced most of my friends and family to cut back and think more about their choices.

I don't subscribe to the vegan moral system, I find it often inconsistent and confused. Like here... What's best for the bees? What's best for the ecosystem? What's best for the humans?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 hours ago (1 children)

Sounds like there is still some room for improvement in terms of "eating as sustainably as they can" then.

I don’t subscribe to the vegan moral system, I find it often inconsistent and confused. Like here… What’s best for the bees? What’s best for the ecosystem? What’s best for the humans?

Do you mean the vegan moral system is confused, or are you confused? Because not many vegans are confused about those things, that much I can tell you.

Right now you're voting with your wallet to increase an economic demand for the death of billions of innocent blades of grass. Not to mention dead animals - but we're not talking about them, that would be silly.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

This is why I find it confused.

I just told you how I'm doing what I can, and having great success convincing others to do the same

I told you I don't subscribe to your moral system

You've entirely ignored most of what I've said and failed to engage me in any area where we have common ground. Instead, you attacked me for not doing more under your own value system

You're working at cross purposes to your goals... You're a hardliner. This approach is why some of my family gatherings have a vegan and a "normal" option for foods that taste basically the same. This is why I can't reach some of my family members on this topic - they were attacked and talked down to for their eating habits, now it's about winning and losing for them

Veganism is not the highest ethics of eating habits. The correct answer to my concern for the suffering of plants was a fruititarian diet... But it isn't higher in my own value system, due to the transport involved

Doing more for me means growing my own food, and maybe keeping chickens. Maybe hunting the occasional deer. It means reintegrating with the ecosystem... But I'm not able to do that yet

Also, voting with your wallet is a lie to keep people complacent. Systematic issues must be solved systematically - already there're huge subsidies for the meat industry to keep prices down and for big agro to over produce certain crops. This can only be changed through collective action

So if you don't want me to see you as confused, ask yourself "what are my goals?" and "am I using the best methods available to me to meet my goals?"

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 hours ago

Claiming I'm the one who's confused only makes you seem delusional. You seem desperate to stir the conversation into a direction where you're getting praised for your diet choices, while I'm still amused about your original comment.

You're standing on the proud achievement of a claim that is not only wrong, even if it was true, it wouldn't work as an argument in your favor. Maybe on some intellectually detached level you are in fact aware how stupid of an argument that really is, so now you're trying to change the topic to vegan goals and systematic issues and convincing people of your unsurpassable approach to a sustainable lifestyle.

I am not a hardliner by any means. And I'm not even talking down your eating habits. I'm talking down dumb arguments.