WiFi does not equal internet. WiFi is a local network that need not be connected to internet at all. So, you could absolutely use a wifi, z-wave or ZigBee solution. Provided the switch and button you use support local control and do not rely on a cloud-based server, internet doesn't come into it.
this post was submitted on 23 Nov 2023
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Home Automation
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ZigBee would be ideal, I'm planning to build a HA solution in the future, but this and a thermostat are the first step.
Do you have an example I could investigate? I'm based in the EU.
I'm not sure where you are and what's available specifically in your region, but a zwave or ZigBee switch relay behind the original switch panel could be controlled by a wireless zwave / ZigBee button directly
That sounds interesting, could you send an example so I can investigate?
Lutron Caseta has a wireless switch you can place anywhere as a control.
They have one now that looks completely normal too, not their hideous old remote
Would it somehow be compatible with the existing "traditional" switch, so both can be used at the same time?
In some other sub, someone suggested me a relay behind the main switch and a wireless ZigBee button, so far it sounds like the best option. Would this be similar in any way?
Lutron Caseta has some good documentation on this. You would need to replace one of your existing switches with their product, and then you can place remotes anywhere you like.
For a three or four way topology, if you want to keep your existing switches, you'll need to use the PD-10NXD, and definitely wire up the neutral.
That is a dimmer. There might be a switch that's compatible with 3/4 way, but I've only used the dimmer.
Thank you for the response, I'll check this out in more detail
I'm not sure what's available for your style light switches. I have a similar situation, I have some of my kitchen lights on a switch on the far side of the room. I can program my zwave switches (both decora-style or toggle-style) to do a different command if they are either held or double or triple tapped. So, I have it if I double tap one, it will turn both that switch and the one on the other side of the room on.
I didn't think this would matter, so I pasted some random light switches I found on the internet just so people get the idea as I don't know how exactly it's called.
Would you mind linking your example so I can investigate into more detail?
I have some kinetic switches in my bathroom for lights and extractor (no power or battery required).
Seems to work well however I have not figured out how to integrate the wifi module with home assistant so I’m considering replacing them if I can find a better option.
what's an extractor? how to pair the wireless switch so it works in complement with the kinetic switches? (eg. if I turn on one or the other, the lights turn on, if I turn off one or the other, the lights turn off)
Extractor fan to remove steam in the bathroom.
The link I shared you can pair switches with receivers.
To pair, you put the receiver in pairing mode then press the light switch you want to use.
They sell “dumb” versions and wifi versions (but as I said I couldn’t figure out how to integrate with home assistant)
An electrician wired it all up for me, I’m not expert on the wiring side of things.
I looked at the products, which one did you get?
I wonder why didn't they put pictures where the small relay goes.. did the electrician connect it behind the manual switch or?
Not sure I fully grasp how this works
I'm using everything Hue...
I bought these https://www.philips-hue.com/en-us/p/hue-philips-hue-wall-switch-module/046677571160 (US link because that's in English, but it's widely available in the EU).
And I've put something like this: https://www.into-led.com/en/eco-dim10-zigbee-led-dimmer-module-250w.html near my light. That way I can use Hue and default lights. In another room, I've but Hue lightbulbs, then you don't need the last one.
If I understood this correctly, then I would need to buy smart light bulbs that go with these?
How does the light dimmer work combined with the wall switch?
You can either buy smart lightbulbs or use the Zigbee dimmer. I have the dimmer attached near the light. The wall module says to the Zigbee switch 'go on' or 'go off'.
The issue I have with this is that I'm not sure if it's even possible to install a relay/dimmer behind the light switch in a 4way traditional light switch, as the cables in EU are just "forwarded" in a loop to the next switch
What I've done (I was on mobile so typing was annoying):
- Disconnected the cables from the traditional lightswitch and connected them through. So basically the light would be on at all time.
- The traditional lightswitch is then connected to the Hue Wall Switch module.
- Near the lightfitting itself, I've placed the dimmer-module.
This doesn't have much to do with the way the cables are 'forwarded', since there's always a black wire that should go to the lamp. The others can be looped though, because they're only creating a circuit.
If it's a changeover (multiple switches connected to a single light, like one at the bottom of the stairs and one at the top), you can still just make sure the light is 'always on' and then connect all the connected switches to a Hue Wall Module.
Philips hue wall module could be set to control a smart light and since it’s battery powered need no electric wiring to it.
Just get one of those automatic motion sensor based bulbs in the kitchen so it'll switch on whenever someone enters. And switch off automatically too. No pressing of a switch required at all.
There are two types of lights in my kitchen, led lights near the wall and strong LED's over the kitchen island - we usually turn them on when cooking, it wouldn't be great if those were motion turned as it's too strong. But thanks for the idea!
Once the led lights turn on, you could have a local switch to control the bright lights there itself. Disconnect the bright lights from the distant panel completely.
Philips hue wall module could be set to control a smart light and since it’s battery powered need no electric wiring to it.
but then I would have to buy a Smart light which is connected to this module?
Yes, or a smart module. Or a smart plug. I’m half way through a renovation and it’s all been pretty confusing. I also have a Homey Pro and I’m not sure if that’s needed for the functionality I described.
Options in Europe include
- LightwaveRF : UK based, quite expensive but a very nice looking range of electronic dimmers that are a straight replacement for light switches, including the 4-gang double width switch in your picture . You can then add similar looking wireless switches anywhere you want. Requires dimmable bulbs.
- Philips Hue as others have said. You would replace all your bulbs with Hue, and then you have two choices: wire all the circuits to be permanently on, replace the switch with a blanking plate and use Hue wireless switches to control them, or use Hue smart switch modules that are wired to your existing switch (this requires one module per circuit, so can cause issues with available space in the back box).
Both of these use local radio comms that still works when your Internet is down.
Thank you for the detailed response, much appreciated!
After reading several other responses, I came to the conclusion that using things via ZigBee might be the best option in the long run, so I can modularly build everything without having to rely on a single vendor.
There are about a zillion options many/most smart switch lines have a battery remote that can typically be paired with any load(s).
The classic OG is Insteon. Their mini-remote screws to the wall surface and add a screwless Decora frame I think it comes-with?) is indistinguishable from a standard Decora switch.
I’ve even mounted one next to a single-gang box and put a two-gang screwless plate over it.
But you got those weird Aussie switches or something and Insteon isn’t popular any more, though the company got saved by then skin of it’s teeth.
any ZigBee options that pop to your mind?
the cleanest option at the moment seems like installing a relay behind the manual switch which can be paired with a wireless remote switch