Info Request: Vermi-Composting : gardening

[–] stochastic_parrot 3 points 2 months ago

We've been doing this for more than 2 years here. We live in a tropical country.

We prefer to use buckets. Similar to this: https://www.ruralsprout.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/vermicomposter.jpg.webp

We only compost raw vegetables and fruits (non-acidic) because that helps to maintain a healthy environment for the worms with less pests. It's also easier to maintain.

The only pests we've had area: ants, flies and beetles. I believe ants and beetles' eggs came with some grass we used. Last weekend, I noticed a tiny frog too. I'm hoping it will help me control the insects. 😁

We have 6x15L buckets plus additional buckets for vermiwash. That's enough for a family of 2.

Benefits: less trash, free nutrients.

Negatives: be prepared to spend half an hour per week in order to mix the waste, kill the ants, clean the buckets, etc.

It doesn't seem to be your case, but I wouldn't recommend vermicomposting to tiny spaces, e.g. apartments, because of the flies.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 months ago (2 children)

How long would it take it break down a body and what would be remaining after?

[–] Rutty 4 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Don’t worry there’s an industry for that. https://www.webmd.com/balance/what-is-human-composting

I was just going to use kitchen scraps.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 months ago

Oh this is for my own information.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 months ago (1 children)

I’ve composted meat and bone. Meat breaks down very rapidly. It’s moist which is key, and everything likes to eat it from bug larva to bacteria. You can expect a nice cut of meat to be unrecognizable a week or two after you place it in the core of a healthy compost heap. I even had the opportunity to try this with human tissue: we saved and froze the placentas from my kids births and I composted them. They melted away very quickly.

Bone is another story entirely. My first year composting I decided to throw the bones from a rib family dinner into my pile. Thereafter I kept finding them when I’d turn my pile or sift out finished compost, and I would just throw them back in to take another turn.

It’s now about 12 years after that and I still occasionally find a rib. At first I tried breaking them up with a hammer but that was a bad idea because they shatter everywhere and turn into sharp shards that don’t break down any better :D Now I just throw them in the garbage when I find them.

So you would have a daily easy time getting down to a skeleton but then you’d be stuck with that AFAIK forever.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

What if you grind it up?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 months ago (1 children)

I guess I’d say first that I don’t have anything on hand to do that with, and I have a lot of shop and garden tools.

If you can turn a skeleton into powder, it’ll no longer be recognizable as a skeleton. It has nothing much to do with composting though. It’s debatable whether the powder would undergo any chemical change by microorganisms. Eggshells for example go into a compost pile and ride along into the soil eventually where they make minerals available to plants, but eggshells don’t get significantly broken down by the composting microorganisms.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Isn’t bonemeal a pretty common soil additive?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Yes, soil additive, not composting material. That’s all I meant. I think the original question was could you compost a body and I said yes except the skeleton and then someone asked what if you grind it up and the answer is still you can’t really compost bone.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 months ago (1 children)

You can’t yourself, but if you heat the compost it’s possible.

Our city takes bones as well as dog and cat poo as well as a host of other stuff you can’t compost personally since it’s a heated above 55c and breaks down all that extra stuff.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (2 children)

Municipal compost is put through a tub grinder, which masticates everything to a fine degree. So even there, it’s not really the heat. They are just grinding it to the point where you can’t distinguish it from other bits of rock and silica in the soil.

Video: https://youtu.be/j_RXRqFB_bM?si=g2_1Pt99qIc9cq6g

Also, I’ve gotten my home compost over 160 degrees F which is considerably hotter. I mean the same pile that these bones have survived.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

Municipal compost shouldn’t be accepting those items if it’s not heated since it doesn’t break down, nor does it kill pathogens off that can be deadly if used for vegetable gardens.

Linky

Heating it in specially designed containers with controlled environments is a little different than the center of the pile getting that hot for a few hours during a hot day.

It’s a stare of the art facility that’s brand new, they’re a little different than most other municipalities.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 months ago (1 children)

I’m not saying the facility doesn’t get hot. It is for sure hot. I’m saying it is not the heat that breaks down bones, but the masticators they use.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

Without the heat it still takes months to years to break down, with the heat it can done in the 21 day cycle.

It’s a culmination of everything, which is why it’s not really possible to do yourself.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 months ago (1 children)

When I say my pile was 160 I do not mean for a few hours on a hot day as you said. It was over 140 for a period of 3 weeks and peaked at 160 for about 5 days. Bones came out of that intact.

Heat + bacteria will not make bones disappear in 21 days or 210 days.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

Maybe read the resource I sent you? Thats factually incorrect, bones do break down, why do you think there’s not trillions of bones all over the earth right now? Because they break down…. The heat exacerbates the break down cycle from months and years to weeks. You lacked the right conditions, that’s why you still had bones, it’s not because they don’t break down, they do. YOU can’t do it, but it absolutely is possible dude.

You seriously think your anecdotal experience is proof when there’s lots of actual physical proof they do break down….? Seriously dude …?

And no, your pile wasn’t that hot, it’s physically impossible for the entire pile to be a consistent temperature throughout its entirety, that’s only the center of the pile. You need the entirely of the pile to be consistent temp for the right conditions. Which again, almost impossible to do without sealed containers and specialized equipment you can’t really get yourself. But you can.

The incredibly ironic thing is, too much heat also kills off the good bacteria… so yeah you really don’t k ow what you’re doing or why if you’re letting it get that hot in it’s core anyways.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Don’t start getting personal with me because you’re failing to prove your point. That is not called for. Your resource says Z E R O about bones. It DOES however back up what I SAID, which is that your commercial composting facility physically grinds up their material:

Step 1 - Food and yard waste is dropped off

Step 2 - Shredding the material

So yeah, before you get on your high horse with me again, maybe read the fucking resource yourself.

I’ve been composting for over a decade here. I do not think that my anecdotal experience overrides all, but if you think you posted scientific proof that solid bones break down at 50C within weeks, you absolutely did not.

I DO think that my decade of direct experience DOES override your bad guesses about what probably goes on at your city facility. Goodbye now. I’ve wasted enough time in this rabbit hole and the vibe is getting shitty in here.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Yes… I explained how shredding it is ONE part of the process…. And explained again how it requires all steps, not just one to be done quickly.

All you’ve repeated is it’s not possible, I’ve provided you with something that says otherwise and you’ve buried your head in the sand.

override your bad guesses about what probably goes on at your city facilit

The resource literally has a video that shows you the entire facility and process, I’m sorry that your quite wrong conclusions about something natural can’t break down. Someone else also brought up bonemeal and you scuffawed at it. If it doesn’t break down to be be absorbed by plants, why the hell is it doing being added the soil fucking soil…?!?!?

The vibe is shitty because someone called out your bullshit and provided you resources to back it up and help educate yourself, and now you are mad to at you weren’t correct for the last decade.

Bones are biodegradable, you are told it’s not in compost since you can’t do it, but that doesn’t mean it’s impossible. So I want to clarify before I throw a whopping amount of scientific literature at you.

You are seriously claiming that bones are NOT biodegradable…? and you want me to provide proof of this beyond what I already did? While the only thing you provided was a video on shredding mulch…. Do I have this right…?

We have incomplete fossils, what do you think happened to those bones if not broken down…?did the dinosaurs have shredders or something too lmfao.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Say a little bit about what you're trying to get out of it and how much material you want to work with. What will you use the castings for?

I got into it a little but, just using a large plastic bin with some holes drilled in it, then half buried in the ground. Stocked it with worms and fed compostables into the bin.

The worms would die back in the winter significantly. I was more focused on seeding my land and all it's gardens and compost piles with worms, not really on converting material. I found regular compost tumblers more efficient and faster, easier too.

[–] Rutty 3 points 2 months ago (1 children)

I don’t know much about vermi composting, but I am thinking of giving it a go.

My thoughts were to get a couple metal grated waste baskets, a bunch of earth worms, shredded cardboard and put one in each of my raised garden beds.

What are its benefits? Downsides(rodents,possums for instance)?

I’d imagine that the worms will distribute their casting’s throughout the garden bed, while making channels for root growth. Ever once in while, I’d probably need to spread the castings from the bin throughout the garden and restart the process.

Guidance is appreciated.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

It's just another way of processing food scrap and yard waste.

You don't need to do anything special for raised beds if you want to have a ton of worms in them, except mulch the tops of the beds every spring and fall,.and occasionally dig a hole and dump in a bunch of uncomposted food waste. Add layers of straw, wood mulch, lawn clippings, whatever, leaf mulch. Worms will devour everything you put on it and turn it to castings.

Read up on windrow vermicomposting to get an idea of how the worms will literally just work their way down a row of food converting all of it to castings. Some people keep worms just in a heap in the middle of the yard, with nothing special except maybe covering with clear plastic over winter. The worm population will wax and wane based on how much food they have, and as long as the food and substrate doesn't completely dry out.

I don't think you should take up raised bed space to put in any kind of composting system unless you absolutely don't have another place to compost. Kind of wastes the advantage of having raised beds if you're not using them for your crops. I'd also suggest starting small, and scaling up after some experience.

As the worms munch, the food they eat goes through them and gets broken down. The worms are home to all sorts of good bacteria that help with breaking things down. That's the idea, break things down so plants can use them, kind of like prechewing their food for them. I'm no expert. I ordered my worms online from Uncle Jim's Worm Farm and they also have a ton of information on their site to help you get it going.

I sort of gave up on keeping worms after a few years. I just used a bin half buried in the ground. And every so often I would spread some of the worms around to the different garden beds on my property, or when I planted something new, or started a new compost bin or compost heap or whatever. They're everywhere now, no point in raising them. All the beds are aerated, tilled, and plants growing well. That's really what the worms and worm castings are for, is enriching the soil. Once your soil is good, if new waste accumulates, the worms that are there take care of it.

Like you can buy worm castings at the store as a soil additive, but if you already have good soil you would not buy worm castings to use just as fertilizer, you'd just buy whatever fertilizer you like. I guess worms are really best for conditioning soil. Part of the thing with raised beds is that you filled them! So they shouldn't need soil conditioning unless they've been abandoned for a long time or if there's been no crop rotation for a long time.

Really no downsides as far as I can think of, other than the time and effort of making sure they are fed and have enough water (if you're using a mostly sealed bin as I was). Too much water is as bad as not enough. When it rains and you see worms come out, it's not because they like the water and want to drink, it's because their house is flooded and they don't want to drown.

I don't know, that's some insight. Feel free to ask some specific questions.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 months ago

I toss my scraps in a pile on the ground and whack it with a shovel every now and again to flip it....

I have crickets and centipedes living in it which is great cause that's it and the centipedes kill practically anything else that tries to live in it.

Honestly I would love to do the tiered buckets and collect the liquid and all that but compost can really be done with 2 wooden boxes in a spot in your yard and a window screen for sifting when you want to use it.

Its just controlled rotting anyways.

Gardening

Step 1 - Food and yard waste is dropped off

Step 2 - Shredding the material