I'm an American but studied abroad in Denmark for around 6 months. When I was there, I found out that the Nordic countries have virtually eradicated down syndrome by testing pregnant people for it. 99% choose to abort. How do you guys feel about this?
Personally this is quite disturbing to me. I've known people with down syndrome who live happy, quality lives. Even if it is up to the mother whether or not to abort, when it happens 99% of the time, is it not cultural eugenics? It seems the culture is almost afraid of taking care of a child with down syndrome. Especially in one of the wealthiest countries in the world, where the resources to take care of them are more widely available. If you could test for other things like autism, or even something like extreme depression, would yall do the same thing?
EDIT: I am strongly pro choice and I have talked to many American people on both sides of the political spectrum about this and they unanimously agree with me. On an individual level, I support everyones right to make their own decisions, but when it gets to the population level it becomes more of a cultural issue. There seems to be a cultural agreement that children with down syndrome are too difficult to care for. Does that make it ok to eradicate them? I honestly don't know
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The original was posted on /r/denmark by /u/queen_bs at 2024-03-13 15:12:18+00:00.
Duck_doc at 2024-03-13 15:25:33+00:00 ID:
kuost0hHonestly people need to stop seeing people with down as some happy people. Many of they have terrible diaseases and never live a good life. Abortion make sense
silversprings99 at 2024-03-13 15:51:13+00:00 ID:
kuoxekgA good life is subjective, some of them are genuinely happy with what they have, but yes, they're prone to diseases and don't have a great life expectancy. I think most people who choose abortion do it for their own sake and not the child with downs tbh. They don't want the burden of raising one and have a different idea of what they want their child to be. It's hard to say if it's ethical or not, but abortion should always be within one's own right. Every child deserves parents who genuinely want them and can provide for them.
Duck_doc at 2024-03-13 16:13:00+00:00 ID:
kup1ca6Agree
queen_bs (OP) at 2024-03-13 16:17:56+00:00 ID:
kup28dnthank you for treating this issue with respect and honesty unlike some of the other commenters. It is absolutely a moral grey area and there is not a clear 'right' answer
danishguy86 at 2024-03-13 17:52:41+00:00 ID:
kupjsd5Yes there is a clear answer. Downs syndrome is not normal. It's not good for the person with the illness, it's not good for society, and it's not good for the family.
queen_bs (OP) at 2024-03-13 18:08:55+00:00 ID:
kupmsubdowns is absolutely normal, just as normal as autism or even depression. I don't know if you can make the claim that it's 'not good' for anyone. While it often causes strain, there are plenty of cases of down syndrome where the person with it and the family live happy lives and I wonder if this possibility is overlooked in many cases
Ok-Cow-1900 at 2024-03-13 18:13:08+00:00 ID:
kupnkjaNo one with downs syndrome has a normal life expectancy.... That alone kills your argument.
Maybe just come to terms with the fact that you are not as pro choice as you think you are.
queen_bs (OP) at 2024-03-13 18:23:25+00:00 ID:
kupphd0just because they might not live as long as everyone else means that they are "not good" for society? I don't understand your argument. I'm also not talking about laws at all (which is what pro-choice is in the US), but the seemingly widely-held belief that down syndrome will ruin your life
Ok-Cow-1900 at 2024-03-13 18:28:15+00:00 ID:
kupqddnBecause it literally gives them a worse life than if they had not had it.
You are saying they are normal, when on every measure they are clearly not.... In fact they are having a horrible life with no chance of getting better, yet you are so selfish that you want them to suffer.
People have the information and the ability to make the best choice, and so far they are making the correct choice.
And again no, you are not pro choice.
SchouDK at 2024-03-13 20:26:51+00:00 ID:
kuqc1waTo be fair I not long ago read it had risen from 35 til 65 since 2000… but it is still nowhere the county average, and for me it is always the mothers / parents choice.
danishguy86 at 2024-03-14 11:49:35+00:00 ID:
kutl8nwSorry, but with all disrespect. You don't know that.
You live in a fantasy world void of facts.
silversprings99 at 2024-03-13 20:02:16+00:00 ID:
kuq7ivfJust fyi, people who can't provide for the economy due to illness or disability deserve to exist... and thinking otherwise is a capitalistic mindset. Humans have been taking care of each other since the dawn of time. Would you say the same thing about the elderly? They're a burden on society as well.
danishguy86 at 2024-03-14 11:47:28+00:00 ID:
kutl01fDeserves to exist. Sure. But that's not what we are talking about.
We are talking about those which can be prevented.
Stop changing the topic
silversprings99 at 2024-03-14 11:50:01+00:00 ID:
kutlahiI was responding to you specifically using the argument that they should be aborted because they are "not good for society". That is a disgusting way of thinking, I'm sorry
danishguy86 at 2024-03-14 11:51:35+00:00 ID:
kutlh4rYes and you are changing the subject. You asked me "would you kill the elderly?"
What a dumb question...
silversprings99 at 2024-03-14 11:54:01+00:00 ID:
kutlrgjIt was a rhetorical question to challenge your viewpoint
danishguy86 at 2024-03-14 12:00:40+00:00 ID:
kutmjt2No it wasn't. It was dumb and unfunny.
Anyone arguing that it is okay to get a baby with severe handicaps don't know what they are talking about or have some mental health issues themselves.
silversprings99 at 2024-03-13 16:27:14+00:00 ID:
kup3xkdThe topic has come up in this sub before and I'm always so appalled by the passionate hate people spew :( like, you can have your opinion and still be respectful...
queen_bs (OP) at 2024-03-13 16:31:15+00:00 ID:
kup4o7xAbsolutely. I'm shocked at the lack of respect in these comments.
Abcdefgwhat at 2024-03-13 16:36:32+00:00 ID:
kup5n2nHuh? From my perspective the majority of the comments are neutral with only a few in bad taste.
queen_bs (OP) at 2024-03-13 17:00:09+00:00 ID:
kupa1n8True but the ones in bad taste are quite shocking. Like one person comparing this issue to vacuuming
Forward-Highway-7765 at 2024-03-13 19:17:38+00:00 ID:
kupzcwaPeople on reddit don't represent the Danes in general. I kind of feel like especially r/Denmark has a lot of "autistic-ish" people with very one-sided opinions and aggressive rhetoric
silversprings99 at 2024-03-13 20:09:05+00:00 ID:
kuq8ryyHey don't insult those of us on the spectrum like that 🥲 But you're right, the demographic on here is... Specific. Lots of trolls. And not representative of Danes as a whole.
Forward-Highway-7765 at 2024-03-13 21:02:28+00:00 ID:
kuqilq6I am myself aswell :D But yes, lots of trolling and immature types
Brilliant_Mind_6069 at 2024-03-13 16:50:52+00:00 ID:
kup8ay9Seriously?
SchouDK at 2024-03-13 20:28:28+00:00 ID:
kuqccqtHe says he is pro choice but do nothing but point fingers with a pure pro life stand… he is a pro life shill.
Reveletionship at 2024-03-14 08:25:29+00:00 ID:
kut2sl9Well i feel its more about the parents not wanting to take care of what nights essentialy be a big toddler for most of their life.
Not saying the person with Downs wont have a decent life, but some of them will experience alot of medical issues as well.
Sentient_Waffle at 2024-03-13 19:53:47+00:00 ID:
kut5avpEven overlooking that, people with Down's usually need life-long care. Many parents give up their jobs and careers to essentially take care of their kid, until they die, which usually happens before the parent.
So not only will you might have to sacrifice a big part of your life, you're also likely to experience the death of your child.
Meanwhile, the other option is to terminate the pregnancy and try again.
Seems like a very easy decision.