this post was submitted on 03 Nov 2023
340 points (90.3% liked)
Memes
45896 readers
1350 users here now
Rules:
- Be civil and nice.
- Try not to excessively repost, as a rule of thumb, wait at least 2 months to do it if you have to.
founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Even if we suppose that's true, you're still failing to illustrate how capital is necessary for production under socialism.
Maybe we should start with what you mean by capital
Given the context of the meme being a picture of Karl Marx, I was using the Marxist definition of capital. Marxists.org provides a pretty digestible definition: https://www.marxists.org/glossary/terms/c/a.htm
Ok good. So capital is required for capex and opex.
As you start with 0 sales you need to get capital from investors to fund you until sales >1
Yes, that is how it works under capitalism.
Under socialism however, the state funds labor based on needs and/or desires for the output of that labor (the commodity). In this case, the money isn't used for the goal of making more money, therefore, this isn't capital at all. And yet, the labor happens and the commodity created. Therefore, the production is independent of the capital.
It's how the state decides to fund things that's the problem though. As has been proven over and over again in multiple countries.
It's great theory, but it's just theory.
What exactly is the relevance? To me it seems like you're just shifting the goal posts.
Decentralisation > centralisation
Power corrupts.
So it's not relevant and you've shifted the goal posts? Got it.
Nope. You said
How it chooses to fund labour is less efficient than decisions made where the decision needs to be made. Centralising power doesn't work. Not in China, not with the EU, not in Russia, not in America
We need new theory, not 19th century failed ones. We're connect at the speed of light, representative forms of government are now unnecessary.
We need local governance, my favourite is sortition and some form of global digital decision making