this post was submitted on 01 Sep 2023
233 points (95.7% liked)
Technology
60359 readers
4889 users here now
This is a most excellent place for technology news and articles.
Our Rules
- Follow the lemmy.world rules.
- Only tech related content.
- Be excellent to each another!
- Mod approved content bots can post up to 10 articles per day.
- Threads asking for personal tech support may be deleted.
- Politics threads may be removed.
- No memes allowed as posts, OK to post as comments.
- Only approved bots from the list below, to ask if your bot can be added please contact us.
- Check for duplicates before posting, duplicates may be removed
Approved Bots
founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Education has a fundamental incentive problem. I want to embrace AI in my classroom. I've been studying ways of using AI for personalized education since I was in grade school. I wanted personalized education, the ability to learn off of any tangent I wanted, to have tools to help me discover what I don't know so I could go learn it.
The problem is, I'm the minority. Many of my students don't want to be there. They want a job in the field, but don't want to do the work. Your required course isn't important to them, because they aren't instructional designers who recognize that this mandatory tangent is scaffolding the next four years of their degree. They have a scholarship, and can't afford to fail your assignment to get feedback. They have too many courses, and have to budget which courses to ignore. The university holds a duty to validate that those passing the courses met a level of standards and can reproduce their knowledge outside of a classroom environment. They have a strict timeline - every year they don't certify their knowledge to satisfaction is a year of tuition and random other fees to pay.
If students were going to university to learn, or going to highschool to learn, instead of being forced there by societal pressures - if they were allowed to learn at their own pace without fear of financial ruin - if they were allowed to explore the topics they love instead of the topics that are financially sound - then there would be no issue with any of these tools. But the truth is much bleaker.
Great students are using these tools in astounding ways to learn, to grow, to explore. Other students - not bad necessarily, but ones with pressures that make education motivated purely by extrinsic factors than intrinsic - have a perfect crutch available to accidentally bypass the necessary steps of learning. Because learning can be hard, and tedious, and expensive, and if you don't love it, you'll take the path of least resistance.
In game design, we talk about not giving the player the tools to optimize their fun away. I love the new wave of AI, I've been waiting for this level of natural language processing and generation capability for a very long time, but these are the tools for students to optimize the learning away. We need to reframe learning and education. We need to bring learning front and center instead of certification. Employers need to recognize this, universities need to recognize this, highschools and students and parents need to recognize this.
This is fine and all and you have a point, but in the current system many times the subject isn't about the subject it's about the auxiliary skills you pick up along the way. My history classes in high schopl weren't really about history. I mean if I retained those facts, fantastic, they were more about analyzing given evidence and multiple references to make a point. I'm an engineer and I use that skill all the time. Facts about the Civil War not so much.
Even in college I had classes like that. It's why just programming the answer wasn't always allowed although literally everyone in the university took a programming class freshmen year. That wasn't always the point.
To always allow AI is like never taking the time to teach kids how to do arithmetic by hand. I mean, sure, we could do that, but learning arithmetic is not really about memorizing times tables and more about understanding the concept of a number and internalizing counting and so much stuff people don't realize they use all the time the existence of a calculator or not.
I think there is some value in not allowing AI usage sometimes. Before you use a calculator you should learn how to do it by hand so you can have a sense of when you've keyed something in wrong. AI has entered my workplace and it's so annoying. People who never knew how to write the things they ask AI to do can't vet the AI output and the result is somehow worse to me than if they'd bumbled something by hand. That's kind of what I'm afraid of in the future. I don't think that AI is ever going to be perfect and kids have to know what output they're looking for before they're taking this shortcut.
I agree mostly with your comment. Math class used to be called logic, because that's really what the general population is there for. Math is a vehicle to learn logical thinking. Those who become engineers or physicists will then learn how to apply those logic skills in their chosen field.
I disagree that history classes were mainly there to analyze evidence to make a point. We learn history, so that we can better participate in discussions, know where we came from, and learn from past mistakes. It's vital that voters have an understanding of history to prevent bad things from happening. Don't get me wrong, the main point about history classes wasn't learning exact dates, but to have a good understanding of the timeline and have a good grasp of major events in the country/world. It's that part, learning details about major events that I'm concerned will be glossed over with AI coming into play. How can you recognize a destructive political trend if you never learned why it was destructive in the past?
I say history is for analysis because honestly anything that would let you truly understand today isn't taught. Yes you will learn about segregation, but my history classes barely touched my grandparent's time, so it's hard to connect that middle missing period to today. Sure. I'm the mind of person to go fill in that middle period, but many people aren't.
What was useful to me was the analysis part. Seeing how bias was in sources. Seeing how different people had the same sources, but different conclusions. Yes, seeing how a past event caused a future event.
But, I don't think many people in the US connect US history with why we have many things going on today. Grade school history isn't going to give that. My college history lessons did though. I had a whole ass history class on nothing by lobbying and I really gained an appreciation for why lobby should exist, how Americans are ridiculous, and how writing laws to keep the good of something, but not the bad is really hard. But no, I cannot tell you anything about the history of lobbying to day I spent 3 months studying and debating about it.
Back to math for a bit. I think that the logic part of math needs to be brought more into focus again. I think that programming is only going to become more and more important and it's a shame we're not teaching any of the fundamentals to allow people to even do things by make fancy excel formulas.