this post was submitted on 07 Dec 2024
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Hello everyone! I would like to know why there seems to be some dislike toward Ubuntu within the Linux community. I would like you to share your reasons for why you like Ubuntu or, on the contrary, why you don't. Thanks 🙇

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[–] [email protected] 56 points 1 week ago (7 children)

The general philosophy behind it.
Ubuntu started out as Debian with some improvements.
Once they were established as the primary Linux distro, they pivoted to an MS-like approach. They tried to invent and implement their own solutions for things that an agreed-upon solution already existed, and was in need of manpower to iron out the kinks (best example is developing Mir instead of throwing their weight behind Wayland, or creating Unity instead of improving Gnome).
They also tried again and again to monetize their OS, which they built on top of millions of volunteer work hours from the Debian project.

All of these efforts failed so far. Their current "we can do it better" project is Snaps, which again duplicates volunteer work instead of contributing to Flatpak which was there before.
I'm willing to admit this one does make sense, since their goal is to make an OS where everything except the kernel and the init system is a snap, something which you can't do with flatpak.
But I'm also pretty sure that'll fail again.

If they simply built an OS with a Debian base, newer packages, 2 releases per year, an LTS every 2 years, and a GUI selector for Gnome or KDE in the installer, they'd be the perfect beginner distro. On the other hand, then they wouldn't make any money.

[–] nyan 5 points 1 week ago (2 children)

On the one hand, diversity is usually a good thing for its own sake, because it reduces the number of single points of failure in the system.

On the gripping hand, none of Ubuntu's many projects has ever become a long-term, distro-agnostic alternative to whatever it was supposed to replace, suggesting either low quality or insufficient effort.

I'm . . . kind of torn. Not that I'm ever likely to switch from Gentoo to Ubuntu, so I guess it's a moot point.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 week ago (1 children)

none of Ubuntu’s many projects has ever become a long-term, distro-agnostic alternative to whatever it was supposed to replace, suggesting either low quality or insufficient effort

I'd add irrational hate against Canonical to the list of possible causes.

systemd was in the hands of one single guy with very controversial ideas in the beginning. It wasn't really better than Upstart, yet got adopted by more and more distributions over time.

Unity worked smoothly when Gnome-Shell was sluggish as hell on the same hardware.

And you have fixed versions every half a year with a set of packages that is guaranteed to work together. On top of that, there's an upgrade path to the next version - no reinstall needed.

Ubuntu's slogan is "Linux for human beings" which fits quite well, I believe. Otherwise, it wouldn't get recommended to newbies so often. If you want all the nerdy stuff, there are plenty of other distributions to choose from. 😉

[–] nyan 2 points 1 week ago

Thing is, even when Ubuntu's software has been packaged outside Ubuntu, it's so far failed to gain traction. Upstart and Unity were available from a Gentoo overlay at one point, but never achieved enough popularity for anyone to try to move them to the main tree. I seem to recall that Unity required a cartload of core system patches that were never upstreamed by Ubuntu to be able to work, which may have been a contributing factor. It's possible that Ubuntu doesn't want its homegrown software ported, which would make its contribution to diversity less than useful.

I’d add irrational hate against Canonical to the list of possible causes.

Canonical's done a few things that make it quite rational to hate them, though. I seem to remember an attempt to shoehorn advertising into Ubuntu, à la Microsoft—it was a while ago and they walked it back quickly, but it didn't make them popular.

(Also, I'm aware of the history of systemd, and Poettering is partly responsible for the hatred still focused on the software in some quarters. I won't speak to his ability as a programmer or the quality of the resulting software, but he is terrible at communication.)

And you have fixed versions every half a year with a set of packages that is guaranteed to work together. On top of that, there’s an upgrade path to the next version - no reinstall needed.

I've been upgrading one of my Gentoo systems continuously since 2008 with no reinstalls required—that's the beauty of a rolling-release distro. And I've never had problems with packages not working together when installing normally from the main repository (shooting myself in the foot in creative ways while rolling my own packages or upgrades doesn't count). Basic consistency of installed software should be a minimum requirement for any distro. I'm always amazed when some mainstream distro seems unable to handle dependencies in a sensible manner.

I have nothing against Ubuntu—just not my cup of tea for my own use—and I don't think it's a bad distro to recommend to newcomers (I certainly wouldn't recommend Gentoo!) Doesn't mean that it's the best, or problem-free, or that its homegrown software is necessarily useful.

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