this post was submitted on 09 Sep 2024
259 points (93.9% liked)

Fuck Cars

9602 readers
877 users here now

A place to discuss problems of car centric infrastructure or how it hurts us all. Let's explore the bad world of Cars!

Rules

1. Be CivilYou may not agree on ideas, but please do not be needlessly rude or insulting to other people in this community.

2. No hate speechDon't discriminate or disparage people on the basis of sex, gender, race, ethnicity, nationality, religion, or sexuality.

3. Don't harass peopleDon't follow people you disagree with into multiple threads or into PMs to insult, disparage, or otherwise attack them. And certainly don't doxx any non-public figures.

4. Stay on topicThis community is about cars, their externalities in society, car-dependency, and solutions to these.

5. No repostsDo not repost content that has already been posted in this community.

Moderator discretion will be used to judge reports with regard to the above rules.

Posting Guidelines

In the absence of a flair system on lemmy yet, let’s try to make it easier to scan through posts by type in here by using tags:

Recommended communities:

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
 

THE NEXT time you are stuck in traffic, look around you. Not at the cars, but the passengers. If you are in America, the chances are that one in 75 of them will be killed by a car—most of those by someone else’s car. Wherever you may be, the folk cocooned in a giant SUV or pickup truck are likelier to survive a collision with another vehicle. But the weight of their machines has a cost, because it makes the roads more dangerous for everyone else. The Economist has found that, for every life the heaviest 1% of SUVs or trucks saves in America, more than a dozen lives are lost in smaller vehicles. This makes traffic jams an ethics class on wheels.

Each year cars kill roughly 40,000 people in America—and not just because it is a big place where people love to drive. The country’s roads are nearly twice as dangerous per mile driven as those in the rest of the rich world. Deaths there involving cars have increased over the past decade, despite the introduction of technology meant to make driving safer.

Weight is to blame. Using data for 7.5m crashes in 14 American states in 2013-23, we found that for every 10,000 crashes the heaviest vehicles kill 37 people in the other car, compared with 5.7 for cars of a median weight and just 2.6 for the lightest. The situation is getting worse. In 2023, 31% of new cars in America weighed over 5,000lb (2.27 tonnes), compared with 22% in 2018. The number of pedestrians killed by cars has almost doubled since 2010. Although a typical car is 25% lighter in Europe and 40% lighter in Japan, electrification will add weight there too, exacerbating the gap between the heaviest vehicles and the lightest.

Archive

https://archive.is/qnsl5

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Except that, E = 1/2 m v^2. You can't get rid of that m. All else being equal, lethality scales linearly with vehicle weight. The safety features that exist are still for the occupants; there are crumple zones for decelerating another vehicle hitting head on, not foam padding for protecting pedestrians. Some features of trucks are extra bad for impacts, but a heavy EV is going to be worse than the same frame with less mass.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

Sure, I never said weight wasn’t a factor but I’m not convinced it’s much of a factor.

Aside from excesses like the monstrosity of an Hummer EV, I’ve read that EVs are typically 20% heavier than a corresponding ICE car. So, any collision is with a vehicle 20% heavier.

However that EV also

  • has a standard height bumper so any car collision will be in the most reinforced spot, as opposed to anything raised/lifted which inflicts that vehicles most reinforced spot on a weaker part of the victim vehicle
  • has a standard hood (except pickups) so any pedestrian collision has a better chance of pedestrian survival, as opposed to the solid wall the is the front of many trucks
  • I likely to have outstanding reflexes and stopping distance to avoid or lessen an accident, being more likely to have advanced automated collision avoidance plus tires that can handle instant torque/braking
  • as more likely to be a car with normal sight lines, is more likely to see and avoid than a truck
  • as lower center of gravity, help with emergency maneuvers so more likely to avoid an accident
[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)
  • Heavier vehicles have worse emergency maneuver and braking performance
  • Majority of EV's sold in the US are SUV/crossovers which have the same visibility issues
  • EV's have ridiculously high rates of acceleration, leading to dangerous driving
[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

You’re assuming weight is the only variable and all else remains the same. It doesn’t.

By far the most common EV sold in the US is a Tesla Model Y. While I suppose you could call it an SUV, it has a normal car hood and forward visibility. It also has far better braking than any other car I’ve owned, while also having far better collision avoidance.

The second most common EV sold in the US is Tesla Model 3, which is a car and similar but better in all of the above.

The third most popular EV in the US is also a car

[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Tesla has notoriously bad rear visibility. And just being a larger vehicle means more blind spots no matter how many cameras/sensors are used to compensate. I've unfortunately been a passenger enough times to know Tesla's collision avoidance stuff doesn't work at all.

The statista link isn't publicly readable, but other sources say Mustang-ev is #3. Ford calls it an SUV. Long-term, the Administration is subsidizing 1-for-1 replacement of the fleet with EV equivalent -- so expect much more SUV/truck in the EV sector if they get their way.