this post was submitted on 06 Jul 2023
65 points (98.5% liked)

Daystrom Institute

3455 readers
4 users here now

Welcome to Daystrom Institute!

Serious, in-depth discussion about Star Trek from both in-universe and real world perspectives.

Read more about how to comment at Daystrom.

Rules

1. Explain your reasoning

All threads and comments submitted to the Daystrom Institute must contain an explanation of the reasoning put forth.

2. No whinging, jokes, memes, and other shallow content.

This entire community has a “serious tag” on it. Shitposts are encouraged in Risa.

3. Be diplomatic.

Participate in a courteous, objective, and open-minded fashion. Be nice to other posters and the people who make Star Trek. Disagree respectfully and don’t gatekeep.

4. Assume good faith.

Assume good faith. Give other posters the benefit of the doubt, but report them if you genuinely believe they are trolling. Don’t whine about “politics.”

5. Tag spoilers.

Historically Daystrom has not had a spoiler policy, so you may encounter untagged spoilers here. Ultimately, avoiding online discussion until you are caught up is the only certain way to avoid spoilers.

6. Stay on-topic.

Threads must discuss Star Trek. Comments must discuss the topic raised in the original post.

Episode Guides

The /r/DaystromInstitute wiki held a number of popular Star Trek watch guides. We have rehosted them here:

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
 

There is something undeniably weird about the new Kirk that we're seeing in Strange New Worlds. He doesn't yet "feel" intuitively like Kirk to me, especially in the rom-com episode. But I do think his writing and, to a lesser extent, his performance show that the writers are thinking deeply about the character and what people have been missing about him. In a sense, SNW may be trying to counteract the phenomenon of Kirk drift, where pop culture stereotypes about the character's impulsive, womanizing ways makes it impossible to understand the person we actually see on screen.

What the first season finale shows us is a Kirk who is by the book, yet decisive and sure of himself. He does not disobey Pike, but he is not afraid to tell him he's wrong -- not based on gut feelings, but based on a sound tactical analysis that proves to be right. Compared to Picard, Kirk -- especially the movie Kirk -- may seem brash and prone to violate the rules, but TOS consistently shows us a captain who respects authority but is willing to push it up to the very limit to protect his crew and achieve his goals. It's interesting that the episode picks up on this aspect of the character as the one that creates an instant bond with Spock. It's not his emotional nature or his instincts or whatever else, it's his respectful yet firm leadership style -- a sharp contrast to Pike's tendency to leave his subordinates to their own devices.

In the romcom episode, the message is a little garbled by the fact that this is an alternate timeline Kirk, but I think it highlights the fact that (a) Kirk is not a compulsive womanizer by any means and (b) Kirk bonds sincerely with women who feel isolated by leadership or other burdens -- not in a predatory way, but in an empathetic way. In contrast to Chris Pine's layabout troublemaker who is constantly getting laid (at least in the first film), the Kirk from TOS is basically a lonely nerd. A charismatic one, to be sure, but still a lonely nerd. Even well into his second command, he's haunted by the guy who bullied him at the Academy! He is, if anything, sexually thwarted by his sense of duty and his "marriage" to the ship. Hence when he meets a woman with a similar predicament, they are drawn to each other. Everyone has a type! It's just a sad coincidence that he wound up meeting someone of his type virtually every episode in season 3.

I don't think it's perfectly executed, at least in the pairing with La'an, but I do like that they're trying to refresh our perspective on the character and that they're doing it in a way that reminds us of all the traits from TOS that the pop culture parody of "Captain Kirk" leaves out. But what do you think?

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I really feel like any feeling of divergence is the result of Kirk's image in popular culture; Steve Shives did a segment on Kirk as we remember him and how accurate that memory is to the actual depiction in TOS, and over time certain traits were magnified in the mainstream.

Wesley's Kirk feels honest--that is to say he resembles Shatner's Kirk, through Wesley's performance.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

i'm really enjoying how kirk and data have been updated to modern sensibilities.

kirk is no longer the womanizer and leading man from the impression that casual viewers got from him (despite it being off from his actual character), but he still charms and the physical version of data is no longer the wooden automaton that the middle aged back in the 80's expected androids to be and is simply the human he had always aspired to be now.